I’ve been a bit confused by one of Theo’s comments since taking over as President of Baseball Operations.
“We need starting pitching. You can’t take your chances very seriously as a club if you go in to the season without, not just five guys you can point to, but six, seven and eight guys. You better know who your ninth starter’s going to be because you’re going to need him. The numbers show that you’re going to need your ninth starter at some point during the course of the year.
“So we have to build our starting pitching depth. We don’t have a ton of depth beyond the obvious guys who are in the rotation right now. That’s a priority.”
Obviously a team needs depth at starting pitching. Then again, a team needs depth in the bullpen, infield, outfield, and behind the plate. Depth is without a doubt an important part of building a contending team. There will be injuries and you have to replace them with competent ballplayers. But do you really need to know your 9th starter is going to be?
That’s probably overstating it. I really doubt Theo Epstein and/or Jed Hoyer really need to know who the 9th starter is going to be. I think, or rather I’m hopeful, that what he means is that you need depth. I think the Cubs are focusing too much on starting pitching and not enough on offense. There are a couple reasons for this. First, the offense is a lot worse than the pitching staff. Second, there are some high quality starting pitchers who will be available via free agency over the next few years while there is little that will be available offensively. So it’s going to be a lot easier to find pitching in the years to come than it will be to find offensive firepower.
Arguing about which is more important to this team is another issue entirely. It’s something that deserves further exploration, but right now I’m curious why they feel they need to be 9 deep in the rotation. Have the Red Sox ever needed a 9th starter? If so, how much have they had to rely on him?
Before I started looking into this I expected that over the years they surely had to have a 9th and probably even 10th or 11th starter. I expected that happened in not just one year, but multiple years. That being said, I also expected that those starters would make few starts and I think if we looked deeper we’d probably find they were primarily spot starts. I wanted to look into the number of starters the Sox needed each year.
In 2003, Derek Lowe, Pedro Martinez, John Burkett and Tim Wakefield made 29 or more starts. Casey Fossum and Jeff Suppan combined for 24 starts and four others made a combined 14 starts.
The following year Pedro, Lowe, Wakefield, Curt Schilling and Bronson Arroyo each made 29 or more starts. Byung-Hyun Kim made 3 while Pedro Astacio and Abe Alverez each started one game apiece.
In 2005, Wakefield, Arroyo, Matt Clement and David Wells each made 30 or more starts. Wade Miller and Curt Schilling combined for 27. Clement and Miller weren’t the only former Cubs to start a game for the Sox that year. Former top prospect Geremi Gonzalez made 3 of them. John Halama and Lenny DiNardo each started one game. Jonathan Papelbon started 3 time.
The 2006 Red Sox rotation had all kinds of injury problems. 14 different pitchers started a game and only Josh Beckett and Schilling started more than 23.
It’s clear at this point that the Sox have gone 9 or more deep in their rotation several times, but I’m still not convinced it’s something you have to plan for. Seriously, if your 9th starter is taking the ball every 5th day for more than a few turns in the rotation you’re probably in big trouble.
93 times the Red Sox have needed an 8th or higher starter since 2003. In Jed Hoyer’s two years in San Diego he needed an 8th starter 6 times and didn’t have to call on a 9th starter. In 11 seasons at the helm between these two they’ve needed at least and 8th starter 99 times. I’m not sure how many innings those guys have pitched, but I’d estimate fewer than 5 innings per start for that caliber a starter. If we estimate an average of 4.5 innings pitched that’s 445 innings. Roughly 41 innings each season have been pitched by an 8th starter or higher. That’s about what you’d expect to get from your 4th best reliever.
Those 41 innings are mostly from the 8th starter’s position of course. There are significantly fewer thrown from starters worse than that. So far the Cubs have paid no attention to pitching so we have to question whether or not Theo was serious. I highly doubt he cares all that much if he knows the name of the guy who would be the 9th starter. I think what he said is nothing more than emphasizing the need for depth. I don’t believe he or Jed are crazy enough to think a 9th starter is all that valuable. There’s just no reason to believe that they’ve been faced with needing a valuable 9th starter over the course of their careers.
You’re essentially looking for the quality of a middle reliever for your 8th starter. The 9th starter would be even worse. The Cubs currently have on their roster Matt Garza, Ryan Dempster, Carlos Zambrano and Randy Wells who would be sure things for the rotation. If the season opened today the 5th starter would probably be Andrew Cashner or Jeff Samardzija. Casey Coleman has made several big league starts so he’d be the 7th guy. Trey McNutt could make some emergency starts. So could Chris Carpenter, Rafael Dolis and Jay Jackson.
I’d like to see the Cubs go after a really good starting pitcher, but they’ve let two free agents sign with other teams and the only quality starters remaining are Roy Oswalt and maybe Paul Maholm. Yu Darvish is available, but will cost a lot of money. If the Cubs are only interested in adding depth I’m not convinced they don’t already have it. If they want to improve the rotation then signing Roy Oswalt or Yu Darvish would be a good idea.
Speaking of Darvish, it brings up something else that has irritated me. For more than a year now the media and fans have said that Darvish could be “just another Daisuke Matsuzaka.” Dice-K was worth 8.3 rWAR in his first two seasons in the US. He struckout nearly a batter per inning and while his walk rate (4.2 per 9) he still struckout 2 batters per walk. He led the league in hits per 9 in his second season allowing fewer than 7 hits per 9 innings. His ERA+ was 127 over those two years. Then he was hit with some injuries. That happens with pitchers. Any time you sign a pitcher you accept that he could spend a lot of time on the DL. He was never the same after the injuries, but early on he more than lived up to expectations.
Darvish is younger and was a significantly better pitcher in Japan. There really is no comparison between the two, but if the best you have is that Dice-K didn’t live up to expectations you’re wrong. He lived up to them and then got injured. Happens all the time.
This doesn’t mean I want the Cubs to shell out $100 million or more to acquire him. I’m just saying that any pitcher could just be another Dice-K. Dice-K was just another Mark Prior. Mark Prior was just another Kerry Wood and so on.
Comments
[quote name=mb21]Can someone explain that to me? That just doesn’t make sense.[/quote]
My guess: If a team has to post a huge fee to win the rights to negotiate, they will probably have less money to offer to Darvish, who is looking for a record salary. So a team may post a high amount just to win the rights, but then not pony up enough dough to sign him, so then they get their posting fee back and nobody gets Darvish.
Aisle424Quote Reply
I don’t know why the Cubs are focusing on their starting pitching when they really need to make sure they have a great backup for Starlin Castro. We all know that not having an all-star waiting in the wings to replace Aramis Ramirez after he lazily separated his shoulder in 2009 was what cost the Cubs a shot at the playoffs. Jim Hendry just didn’t know how to construct a roster.
/2009 morans
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]My guess: If a team has to post a huge fee to win the rights to negotiate, they will probably have less money to offer to Darvish, who is looking for a record salary. So a team may post a high amount just to win the rights, but then not pony up enough dough to sign him, so then they get their posting fee back and nobody gets Darvish.[/quote]I think that is something the Japanese team has to decide within those 4 days, right? Because if the US team doesn’t end up signing Darvish then the Japanese team doesn’t end up with anything.
So let’s say a small market team like the Pirates post $50 mil, but the Red Sox post $40 mil. The Japanese team may think about choosing the Red Sox since they would be most likely to give Darvish the contract he wants.
Why the Pirates would post $50 mil then not have the money to sign Darvish though doesn’t make sense so I doubt this would happen.
WaLiQuote Reply
Highest bidder wins.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]My guess: If a team has to post a huge fee to win the rights to negotiate, they will probably have less money to offer to Darvish, who is looking for a record salary. So a team may post a high amount just to win the rights, but then not pony up enough dough to sign him, so then they get their posting fee back and nobody gets Darvish.[/quote]I’d think it would be the exact opposite. If you’re willing to pay that much in a posting fee you’re probably more likely to pay more in salary. At least that’s what I would think, but I don’t know.
mb21Quote Reply
The amount of the posting fee is correlated to the salary a player gets.
mb21Quote Reply
RDJ Venn Diagram:
MishQuote Reply
Great post, mb. I hadn’t heard that quote from Epstein. My guess would be that he wasn’t implying that you need to make sure your ninth starter is a better-than-average MLB pitcher, but that the reason depth is important is because you’re likely to go several pitchers deep into your starting rotation reserves. It’s not that filling out the depth chart is a crucial part of season strategy, it’s just a reality you’ve got to face.
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Highest bidder wins.[/quote]So the Ham Fighters only get to see the highest bid? Why the hell do they need 4 days then?
WaLiQuote Reply
[quote name=Mish]RDJ Venn Diagram:
http://cdn.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/rdj-venn-650×638.png%5B/quote%5D
That actually made sense.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=WaLi]So the Ham Fighters only get to see the highest bid? Why the hell do they need 4 days then?[/quote]I think GBTS’ link yesterday suggested that even if the Ham get their highest bid, they can still reject it and not allow Darvish to negotiate.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=AndCounting]Great post, mb. I hadn’t heard that quote from Epstein. My guess would be that he wasn’t implying that you need to make sure your ninth starter is a better-than-average MLB pitcher, but that the reason depth is important is because you’re likely to go several pitchers deep into your starting rotation reserves. It’s not that filling out the depth chart is a crucial part of season strategy, it’s just a reality you’ve got to face.[/quote]Yeah, I’m just wondering whether the focus on pitching is where it should be. I don’t think it should be. I think the Cubs have plenty of depth when you consider the average 5th starter basically sucks. The average 8th or 9th starter is a Little League pitcher. (dying laughing)
mb21Quote Reply
The Cubs need nine SP like I need another hole in my head.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
500 ———————————————–> number of fucks not given
Suburban kid 22Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Yeah, I’m just wondering whether the focus on pitching is where it should be. I don’t think it should be. I think the Cubs have plenty of depth when you consider the average 5th starter basically sucks. The average 8th or 9th starter is a Little League pitcher. (dying laughing)[/quote]Theo might also be a little sensitive on this issue given the way the Boston rotation got sick and died at the end of last season. And I remember the joke being that the Cubs were dumb to have 12 pitchers vying for rotation spots last spring, and it turned out not to be enough. (dying laughing)
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=Suburban kid 22]500 ———————————————–> number of fucks not given[/quote]That’s a fuckload of fucks.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I stopped after the episode after the cabin one. Brody was a terrorist. Then he wasn’t. A presumed dead guy was. Then Brody was a terrorist. I liked 24, but was hoping this wouldn’t have the unnecessary twists and turns. I’ll probably watch the rest of season 1 at some point.[/quote]I was at least happy that Homeland made that switcheroo in the span of one episode. 24 made their insane OMG EVERYTHING U KNOW IS WRONG twists every like six episodes.
That said, it’s still been really strong. We’ve learned a lot more about why Brody is doing what he’s doing. And last Sunday’s episode was probably the best of the entire season, cabin episode included.
GBTSQuote Reply
The Cubs bought the land across Clark St. that currently houses a McDonalds. Intention is to redevelop the plot to increase revenue. I’ve read in other publications that that McDonald’s is one of the most profitable in the country, so I can’t imagine it was cheap.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/9438507-418/cubs-buy-mcdonalds-property-across-from-wrigley-field.html
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
Cubs bought the mcdonalds property across the street from Wrigley, will probably be folded into Triangle Building plan somehow
BerseliusQuote Reply
That was my thought too. That place must be insanely slammed on game days. I hope they know to check http://www.isthereacubsgametoday.com
BerseliusQuote Reply
(dying laughing), the Red Sox just traded Lowrie and a SP prospect to the Astros for a reliever
BerseliusQuote Reply
This could also be a complicated gambit to lure Prince Fielder. Or they could replace it with a Popeye’s and try to get Josh Beckett’s interest
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius](dying laughing), the Red Sox just traded Lowrie and a SP prospect to the Astros for a reliever[/quote]
what the….
GWQuote Reply
anybody had any experience buying something on etsy.com?
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]anybody had any experience buying something on etsy.com?[/quote]Winner, Least Expected Comment of 2011
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]anybody had any experience buying something on etsy.com?[/quote]
Never had a problem buying from there
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=AndCounting]Theo might also be a little sensitive on this issue given the way the Boston rotation got sick and died at the end of last season. And I remember the joke being that the Cubs were dumb to have 12 pitchers vying for rotation spots last spring, and it turned out not to be enough. (dying laughing)[/quote]True, but if that happens you’re kinda fucked. It’s like losing you entire infield.
So far Thoyer has paid little to no attention to starting pitching so I’m kind of happy. If they want to go after Oswalt, great. Maybe Maholm, but nobody else.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]anybody had any experience buying something on etsy.com?[/quote]Yeah I bought something there once before. No issues.
WaLiQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius](dying laughing), the Red Sox just traded Lowrie and a SP prospect to the Astros for a reliever[/quote]Lowrie hasn’t hit much, but this is still an odd deal.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Lowrie hasn’t hit much, but this is still an odd deal.[/quote]It’s almost as if the Red Sox became retarded overnight. It’s odd. I’ve always hated them because of their fans so I’m enjoying it.
mb21Quote Reply
The Cubs may not have the worst 5 starters in the NL, but they may have the worst 9. Once you get past the MLB roster, there is almost no start-worthy pitcher.
Last year, most MLB teams burned through 7 to 8 pitchers. Having at least 7 dependable starters is a must. Especially if Andrew Cashner is penciled in as a starter again.
Also: A note on Daisuke: He was epicly — I mean EPICLY — overworked in Japan. From high school through the NPB, Daisuke was throwing WAY too many pitches. Injuries were always about to happen.
No so with Darvish. Yu is the real thing. I would be thrilled if the Cubs got him. And, honestly, with the second Wild Card, Darvish and maybe Fielder / a breakout from LaHair could put the Cubs in a playoff race.
Of course, adding Maholm and a few high-minor-league pitchers wouldn’t hurt either. Maybe grab Andy Sonnanstine for Triple-A?
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
Phil Rogers word vomit:
Also:
Phil’s darts hit some weird places on the dartboard today.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]Phil Rogers word vomit:
Phil’s darts hit some weird places on the dartboard today.[/quote]Cubs management is aware of the existence of Varitek and Wakefield, and they don’t hate them. It’s possible this roster is so depleted that either of them might fit. But then again, no.
Thanks, Phil.
AndCountingQuote Reply
i wouldnt mind wakefield
dylanjQuote Reply
Speaking of pitchers…
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/14/wade-davis-and-jeff-niemann-are-rays-pitchers-most-likely-to-be-shopped/
Want? Do not want?
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]Speaking of pitchers…
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/14/wade-davis-and-jeff-niemann-are-rays-pitchers-most-likely-to-be-shopped/
Want? Do not want?[/quote]As a Rays fan, I can attest both are good pitchers and would have success in the NL, for sure. Maybe not Garza success, but they would definitely do well.
Davis has a Longoria contract, and he also has better upside than Niemann, but he’s struggled much more than Niems at the MLB level.
Niemann, meanwhile, has had injury problems, but when he’s healthy (which is like 75% of the time), he’s pretty good.
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
The Cubs rotation is nowhere near the worst in the NL. I’d bet their top 9 is nowhere near the worst either.
Also, Brad, what do you mean by dependable? When I think of dependable I think of a 4th or 5th starter. The average 5th starter is below replacement. http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/how-good-is-your-4-starter/
That’s from 2006, but that year in the NL the average 5th starter had a 6.26 ERA. That’s a run worse than replacement. If you have 7 or 8 guys better than the average 5th starter you’ll be trading them for valuable pieces. Those are guys that should be in a rotation and not serve as depth. The 6th, 7th and 8th starters will be progressively worse than the 6.2 ERA that the 5th starter had.
In my opinion, few teams have even 5 dependable starters. I just don’t consider someone who is a run worse per 9 than replacement to be dependable.
mb21Quote Reply
agreed with MD. I mean it would be great if we had serviceable arms in AAA and didnt have to suffer the unholy trinity of James Russell (the starter) Lopez, Doug Davis ect but that could be said of a lot of teams without a deep farm.
Getting lucky with pitching health is a big key to having a good year. Not alot of teams will go far if you need 9 starters for very long
dylanjQuote Reply
I also don’t agree that Daisuke has been overworked while Darvish hasn’t been. From 18-24 Dice-K threw 1216 innings. Darvish has thrown 1268. Darvish struck out close to a half batter per 9 more, but did walk about half a better less per 9. Accounting for the increased innings I’d bet there’s little to no difference in the number of pitches these guys threw between 18 and 24. Dice-K’s final season in Japan was at age 25. Darvish’s final season is probably at age 24.
Dice-K went over 200 innings twice. Darvish has done it four times.
I have no idea about high school, but I’m not sure I’d put much weight into any information I could find about that. Based on how Japanese pitchers are worked I would be surprised if there’s a significant difference there either.
mb21Quote Reply
The Cubs had the worst differential between FIP and ERA in the league last year, so their pitching probably wasn’t as bad as it looked. I also doubt that the likes of Coleman, Ortiz, Davis and Lopez are any worse than other teams’ emergency starters.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]agreed with MD. I mean it would be great if we had serviceable arms in AAA and didnt have to suffer the unholy trinity of James Russell (the starter) Lopez, Doug Davis ect but that could be said of a lot of teams without a deep farm.
Getting lucky with pitching health is a big key to having a good year. Not alot of teams will go far if you need 9 starters for very long[/quote]Exactly. I can understand wanting 9 starters, but focus on finding 5 decent ones and assume some players will be available because they were cut or coming back from injury.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=ACT]The Cubs had the worst differential between FIP and ERA in the league last year, so their pitching probably wasn’t as bad as it looked. I also doubt that the likes of Coleman, Ortiz, Davis and Lopez are any worse than other teams’ emergency starters.[/quote]I was just going to say that, but I thought I’d look into it. Doug Davis certainly didn’t perform as well as I expected, but based on projections he’s a pretty damn good pitcher to have 6th, 7th or 8th.
Take the Cubs rotation in 2004. They didn’t even have 5 dependable starters. Kerry Wood was an injury waiting to happen. Carlos Zambrano was coming off a very good 2003, but many pitchers have had good first seasons and gone on to flame out. Matt Clement had been good for a couple years. Maddux was old. Prior was young and coming off a full season. Take the 2008 rotation after they acquired Harden. No way anyone can say Harden is dependable. Zambrano was starting to break. Entered the season with an average to below average closer in the rotation.
mb21Quote Reply
BerseliusQuote Reply
It also bears repeating that the Cubs’ top 2 offensive performers from last year were lost to free agency. LaHair might replace much of Pena’s production, but Stewart is nowhere close to Ramirez. If they don’t add another bat, their offense will be positively rotten.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=ACT]It also bears repeating that the Cubs’ top 2 offensive performers from last year were lost to free agency. LaHair might replace much of Pena’s production, but Stewart is nowhere close to Ramirez. If they don’t add another bat, their offense will be positively rotten.[/quote]This is why I’m so surprised much more focus hasn’t been on offense. The media doesn’t know shit because they’re lazy. My guess is Theo and Hoyer are more concerned about the offense. I hope so.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Also, Brad, what do you mean by dependable? When I think of dependable I think of a 4th or 5th starter. The average 5th starter is below replacement. http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/how-good-is-your-4-starter/%5B/quote%5D
And the average team doesn’t make the playoffs. Most good rotations (and the Cubs need a good rotation because their offense still sucks) have near-majors prospects or borderline Quad-A starters who can fill in as needed.
For instance, the Phillies had Vance Worley (a top prospect) and Kyle Kendrick (an above average long-man); the Rays had Alex Cobb and Matt Moore (and a whole system of elite arms); the Red Sox had Kyle Weiland and Andrew Miller (though both of those prospects got blown up); and the Brewers had Marco Estrada, another capable swingman.
Behind their top five, the Cubs had Doug Davis, Rodrigo Lopez (who ended up getting the 5th most innings), James Russell, and a cavalcade of UGH.
The closest thing the Cubs have to an MLB-ready minor league starter is Casey Coleman, which is really bad sign, IMHO.
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
I’ve heard a bit about the Cubs being in on Fielder. Really, there aren’t many good FA bats available.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]I don’t know why the Cubs are focusing on their starting pitching when they really need to make sure they have a great backup for Starlin Castro. We all know that not having an all-star waiting in the wings to replace Aramis Ramirez after he lazily separated his shoulder in 2009 was what cost the Cubs a shot at the playoffs. Jim Hendry just didn’t know how to construct a roster.
/2009 morans[/quote]
Cubs need to sign Jimmy Rollins to back up Castro. If Castro goes down, the offense is fucked. You always have to think one step ahead. I’m sure Thoyer has plans moving to trade for Joey Votto and then sign Fielder to back him up too.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I also don’t agree that Daisuke has been overworked while Darvish hasn’t been. From 18-24 Dice-K threw 1216 innings. Darvish has thrown 1268. Darvish struck out close to a half batter per 9 more, but did walk about half a better less per 9. Accounting for the increased innings I’d bet there’s little to no difference in the number of pitches these guys threw between 18 and 24. Dice-K’s final season in Japan was at age 25. Darvish’s final season is probably at age 24.
Dice-K went over 200 innings twice. Darvish has done it four times.
I have no idea about high school, but I’m not sure I’d put much weight into any information I could find about that. Based on how Japanese pitchers are worked I would be surprised if there’s a significant difference there either.[/quote]
I seem to remember stories about Daisuke throwing a gabillion (that’s a scientific unit) pitches between starts too, and suggested that throwing programs over there are a lot different than here. Wonder if Darvish was similarly handled with unCare.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Cubs_Stats]And the average team doesn’t make the playoffs. Most good rotations (and the Cubs need a good rotation because their offense still sucks) have near-majors prospects or borderline Quad-A starters who can fill in as needed.
For instance, the Phillies had Vance Worley (a top prospect) and Kyle Kendrick (an above average long-man); the Rays had Alex Cobb and Matt Moore (and a whole system of elite arms); the Red Sox had Kyle Weiland and Andrew Miller (though both of those prospects got blown up); and the Brewers had Marco Estrada, another capable swingman.
Behind their top five, the Cubs had Doug Davis, Rodrigo Lopez (who ended up getting the 5th most innings), James Russell, and a cavalcade of UGH.
The closest thing the Cubs have to an MLB-ready minor league starter is Casey Coleman, which is really bad sign, IMHO.[/quote]
FWIW, one of the big problems with that is that they thought they would have two MLB-ready starters by now in Jay Jackson and Trey McNutt. Those stars fell insanely far this year.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]I seem to remember stories about Daisuke throwing a gabillion (that’s a scientific unit) pitches between starts too, and suggested that throwing programs over there are a lot different than here. Wonder if Darvish was similarly handled with unCare.[/quote]From what I’ve heard, Darvish has been used, but not abused — at least like Daisuke was:
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/yu-darvish-real-deal/
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/darvish-is-not-daisuke/
Sorry for the long quotes.
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
[quote name=Cubs Stats]Sorry for the long quotes.[/quote]
You should have read the seven Posts about Posts before writing that comment. Every quote needs to have an attribution, no exceptions. Please don’t come back here for a week.
I’m watching you.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]You should have read the seven Posts about Posts before writing that comment. Every quote needs to have an attribution, no exceptions. Please don’t come back here for a week.
I’m watching you.[/quote]
MishQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]You should have read the seven Posts about Posts before writing that comment. Every quote needs to have an attribution, no exceptions. Please don’t come back here for a week.
I’m watching you.[/quote]F this place! I’m going to start my own accredited discredited blog!
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
My preference is Davish simply due to the CBA ramifications and the age factor. If we dont get him then I wouldn’t mind having Fuck Fuck as our 1B
dylanjQuote Reply
The Rays gave a Rodrigo Lopez-like pitcher 184 innings last year.
ACTQuote Reply
Good post. That reminds me, the Fangraphs podcast the other day had a good point: that the two words that best explain why Matt Moore’s new contract was rational for him are “Mark” and “Prior”.
fang2415Quote Reply
[quote name=ACT]The Rays gave a Rodrigo Lopez-like pitcher 184 innings last year.[/quote]Juan Cruz?
fang2415Quote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]anybody had any experience buying something on etsy.com?[/quote]
i buy shit for my wife on there with some regularity. she loves that stuff, so i just sign into her account and look on her favorites list, then go under my own account to buy it. usually means:
recalcitrant nate’s wife——> happy
work sucksQuote Reply
[quote name=ACT]The Rays gave a Rodrigo Lopez-like pitcher 184 innings last year.[/quote]Except Wade Davis is young, a recent top prospect, and he was deliberately and literally testing new approaches during the season.
His last three months were very different (in approach) than his first three months. He went from ~4 K/9 to ~6 K/9 and his FIP went down with it.
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
Win: http://mlb.sbnation.com/2011/12/14/2635923/jeff-bagwell-hall-of-fame
MishQuote Reply
You don’t have to have a rotation with 13 average starting pitchers to reach the rotation, Brad. Name one team that entered the season last year with a decent 8th starter. By decent I mean replacement level. I’ll bet $50 there wasn’t one.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mish]Win: http://mlb.sbnation.com/2011/12/14/2635923/jeff-bagwell-hall-of-fame%5B/quote%5D
Al retweeted it, so I looked at it to mock Al and it was actually funny.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]Al retweeted it, so I looked at it to mock Al and it was actually funny.[/quote]
Obviously, Al didn’t write it.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]I seem to remember stories about Daisuke throwing a gabillion (that’s a scientific unit) pitches between starts too, and suggested that throwing programs over there are a lot different than here. Wonder if Darvish was similarly handled with unCare.[/quote]From what I’ve read they all throw a lot in between starts. I’m pretty sure that Valentine has said that before. I don’t think there’s any difference in the abuse that Dice-K had and Darvish. The abuse was a slight concern a few years ago, but most of it has been after the fact.
mb21Quote Reply
For all the talk about improving pitching, the Cubs new FO has acquired 2 players and they are both position players. They are position players who can in fact play defense tho. So maybe it’s their way of saying: “Our offense is so bad, it should go without stating that we need to improve it. However we also have an average at best rotation, and we won fucking 71 games last year. We have a long way to go in several areas, so as we try to improve our obviously miserable offense, we are simultaneously looking for offensive hitters who can also play some semblance of defense because that is an effective way to also improve our run prevention.”
work sucksQuote Reply
[quote name=work sucks] usually means:
recalcitrant nate’s wife——> happy
usually means
recalcitrant nate——> getting some[/quote].
WaLiQuote Reply
[quote name=work sucks]For all the talk about improving pitching, the Cubs new FO has acquired 2 players and they are both position players. They are position players who can in fact play defense tho. So maybe it’s their way of saying: “Our offense is so bad, it should go without stating that we need to improve it. However we also have an average at best rotation, and we won fucking 71 games last year. We have a long way to go in several areas, so as we try to improve our obviously miserable offense, we are simultaneously looking for offensive hitters who can also play some semblance of defense because that is an effective way to also improve our run prevention.”[/quote]
Keep pitching corps intact + improve defense + sign Prince Fielder —> profit
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=work sucks]For all the talk about improving pitching, the Cubs new FO has acquired 2 players and they are both position players. They are position players who can in fact play defense tho. So maybe it’s their way of saying: “Our offense is so bad, it should go without stating that we need to improve it. However we also have an average at best rotation, and we won fucking 71 games last year. We have a long way to go in several areas, so as we try to improve our obviously miserable offense, we are simultaneously looking for offensive hitters who can also play some semblance of defense because that is an effective way to also improve our run prevention.”[/quote]Yes. I mentioned that in the post, but I’m not sure the rotation is that bad. I think it’s above average if they keep Zambrano.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]You don’t have to have a rotation with 13 average starting pitchers to reach the rotation, Brad. Name one team that entered the season last year with a decent 8th starter. By decent I mean replacement level. I’ll bet $50 there wasn’t one.[/quote]
I think the concern the Cubs have is that they don’t have young pitching ready to step in. The minors are a wasteland since every halfway decent option pretty much tanked, got injured, or tanked and then got injured last year.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]I think the concern the Cubs have is that they don’t have young pitching ready to step in. The minors are a wasteland since every halfway decent option pretty much tanked, got injured, or tanked and then got injured last year.[/quote]
This.
BerseliusQuote Reply
Morosi:
yes please, where do i sign
work sucksQuote Reply
[quote name=work sucks]Morosi:
yes please, where do i sign[/quote]That seems like a better plan. Paying Fielder $30MM per year still sounds crazy though.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]You don’t have to have a rotation with 13 average starting pitchers to reach the rotation, Brad. Name one team that entered the season last year with a decent 8th starter. By decent I mean replacement level. I’ll bet $50 there wasn’t one.[/quote]No. 8 doesn’t have to be above replacement level, just No. 6 and maybe No. 7.
No. 8 and No. 9 need to be no worse than replacement level (as Doug Davis was, despite his hot start). Rodrigo can fit in the 8 or 9 slot — the problem was that he was No. 6.
For fun, let’s look at the Rays rotation. I’d wager they have the best pitching depth in the majors.
1. Price (Elite)
2. Shields (Elite)
3. Hellickson (Good-to-great with upside)
4. Davis (Good with upside)
5. Niemann (Good with upside)
6. Alex Cobb (Good with upside, actually was 6th starter during their brief six-man rotation)
7. Alex Torres (Good with upside)
8. Matt Moore (Great with Elite upside)
9. Andy Sonnanstine (replacement level)
The Rays had 8 above average starters and 1 replacement level pitcher (who, in all honesty, might be somewhere above or below replacement level; it’s hard to say, he got used very little in 2011).
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
Kerry Wood threw about 160 in a high school start and we talked about how abused he was in high school. So even if we want to say it wasn’t as bad as Dice-K (smallest midget thing in my opinion), it was as bad and more than likely worse than Kerry Wood. The bottom line is that Yu Darvish started throwing a shitload of pitches at a very early age. He was abused in the same way Kerry Wood was and then some.
This is missing the point entirely though. Dice-K was very good early in his career. Pitchers break. I don’t care why. It happens all the time. Many of them will break this year. Probably even a couple Cubs starters. Dice-K was worth the investment at the time and Darvish will be too.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]I think the concern the Cubs have is that they don’t have young pitching ready to step in. The minors are a wasteland since every halfway decent option pretty much tanked, got injured, or tanked and then got injured last year.[/quote]I’m not saying they shouldn’t add some depth, but I don’t want them paying any more than they would for a middle reliever. Pick a couple guys up like Rodrigo Lopez and stash them in the minors.
mb21Quote Reply
And lets not forget the super hype that Dice K came in with. Unhittable gyroball pitches ect ect. The guy was an above average starter but not an “ace”. Honestly even at this point I would see if the Sox would give up on him and take a shot . Maybe swap Z and Dice K
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]I think the concern the Cubs have is that they don’t have young pitching ready to step in. The minors are a wasteland since every halfway decent option pretty much tanked, got injured, or tanked and then got injured last year.[/quote]Yeah, same here. Not saying Darvish is a must, but getting him does mean that List of Nine moves at least 8 names downward, creating depth by nothing more than suppressing service from Coleman or the like.
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
[quote name=Cubs_Stats]No. 8 doesn’t have to be above replacement level, just No. 6 and maybe No. 7.
No. 8 and No. 9 need to be no worse than replacement level (as Doug Davis was, despite his hot start). Rodrigo can fit in the 8 or 9 slot — the problem was that he was No. 6.[/quote]I don’t understand why the 6 or 7 has to be this or that. if you’re number 1 starter is a 2-WAR pitcher then your 6th, 7th and 8th guys better be above replacement level. If you’re ace is a 4, 5 or 6 WAR pitcher it changes things. It doesn’t much matter to me if the 1st through 10th guys on one team are worth 8 WAR and on another team the ace is worth 8 WAR and everybody else is replacement level. I don’t care how they get there.
I wouldn’t touch the pitching staff. The Cubs are unlikely to contend so I’m not spending money on an over the hill Oswalt or Maholm. There are some quality pitchers who will be available over the next two or three years.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=work sucks]For all the talk about improving pitching, the Cubs new FO has acquired 2 players and they are both position players. They are position players who can in fact play defense tho. So maybe it’s their way of saying: “Our offense is so bad, it should go without stating that we need to improve it. However we also have an average at best rotation, and we won fucking 71 games last year. We have a long way to go in several areas, so as we try to improve our obviously miserable offense, we are simultaneously looking for offensive hitters who can also play some semblance of defense because that is an effective way to also improve our run prevention.”[/quote]The problem is that the Cubs total equation last year was:
Averageish pitching + averageish offense + fielding/baserunning abominations = 71 wins
I’m thinking they take this approach if they can’t get Fielder to the right deal:
Good pitching + averageish offense + decent fielding/baserunning ~ 80 wins?
And I’d be okay with that, assuming the pitching upgrade is young (for instance, Roy Oswalt would not be right unless they get both Darvish and Fielder too).
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
I wouldn’t mind Darvish, but if it was my money there’s no way I’d sign him. Since it’s the Cubs money I hope they do, but that’s a huge risk.
mb21Quote Reply
another thing to keep in mind is that if you need 6789 starters for more than a few spot starts your fucked anyways.
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]This is why I’m so surprised much more focus hasn’t been on offense. The media doesn’t know shit because they’re lazy. My guess is Theo and Hoyer are more concerned about the offense. I hope so.[/quote]
I hope so and i think so. MB, in the quote that you wrote the main page article about, note that theo says “not just five guys you can point to, but six, seven and eight guys.” And then he says “You better know who your ninth starter’s going to be because you’re going to need him.” It really seems to me that going to the ninth guy in the last sentence is exaggerating to make a point. And, even if you take it literally, what he’s saying is that you need to know who that guy is and be prepared for the situtation, not that that 9th guy needs to be even an average MLB pitcher. I think what he’s really saying is “We’re not going to assume that only our 5 starters will pitch. We need some depth at pitching and I’m going to exaggerate a little to explain why because the world is full of morons, some of whom are Chicago sportswriters, who don’t understand why.”
I also think its worth noting that he was saying this as Pujols/Fielder fever was in full swing, and that he was making an effort to lower expectations and give the press something to speculate about besides “ZOMG THE CUBS WILL/WON’T GET PUJOLS!”
UrkQuote Reply
I think the Cubs come closer to 70 wins than 80. I won’t be surprised if they don’t even win 70. I expect them to be out of contention and we’ll see Garza, Byrd, Soto and Marshall traded. Maybe Marmol too.
This assumes the Cubs aren’t interested in Fielder.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Urk]I hope so and i think so. MB, in the quote that you wrote the main page article about, note that theo says “not just five guys you can point to, but six, seven and eight guys.” And then he says “You better know who your ninth starter’s going to be because you’re going to need him.” It really seems to me that going to the ninth guy in the last sentence is exaggerating to make a point. And, even if you take it literally, what he’s saying is that you need to know who that guy is and be prepared for the situtation, not that that 9th guy needs to be even an average MLB pitcher. I think what he’s really saying is “We’re not going to assume that only our 5 starters will pitch. We need some depth at pitching and I’m going to exaggerate a little to explain why because the world is full of morons, some of whom are Chicago sportswriters, who don’t understand why.”
I also think its worth noting that he was saying this as Pujols/Fielder fever was in full swing, and that he was making an effort to lower expectations and give the press something to speculate about besides “ZOMG THE CUBS WILL/WON’T GET PUJOLS!”[/quote]Yea, Urk, I understood he didn’t mean the 9th guy had to be average or anything. Theo isn’t an idiot and he surely knows that the average 5th starter sucks ass. This is why, in my opinion, we’ve heard very few rumors about the Cubs being interested in pitching. Those 6th, 7th, 8th and 9th starters are already on the roster.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]another thing to keep in mind is that if you need 6789 starters for more than a few spot starts your fucked anyways.[/quote]Yeah, it’s one of those things that if it happens you’re pissed, but what can you do?
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I don’t understand why the 6 or 7 has to be this or that. if you’re number 1 starter is a 2-WAR pitcher then your 6th, 7th and 8th guys better be above replacement level. If you’re ace is a 4, 5 or 6 WAR pitcher it changes things. It doesn’t much matter to me if the 1st through 10th guys on one team are worth 8 WAR and on another team the ace is worth 8 WAR and everybody else is replacement level. I don’t care how they get there.[/quote]It only matters because of injuries. The Rangers needed only 5 starts — just five combined starts — from their 6 and 7 starters. That’s absurd, and it’s a large reason why they won their division and reached the World Series. (The Rangers, IMHO, lack any real pitching depth, which is fine if you score like 50 runs per inning.)
So if pitcher No. 1 is an 8-win guy, then losing him hurts a lot less with a 2-win guy in the wings as opposed to a replacement level, 0 win guy — especially if you miss the second Wild Card spot by 1 win.
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
well and think of our 2008 team. Thats the most pitching Rich Harden has done since he was a brand new pitcher. We had great health for the most part and had a great season.
Pitching health is the big thing because there just arent alot of people capable of getting big league hitters out.
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=Urk]I hope so and i think so. MB, in the quote that you wrote the main page article about, note that theo says “not just five guys you can point to, but six, seven and eight guys.” And then he says “You better know who your ninth starter’s going to be because you’re going to need him.” It really seems to me that going to the ninth guy in the last sentence is exaggerating to make a point. And, even if you take it literally, what he’s saying is that you need to know who that guy is and be prepared for the situtation, not that that 9th guy needs to be even an average MLB pitcher. I think what he’s really saying is “We’re not going to assume that only our 5 starters will pitch. We need some depth at pitching and I’m going to exaggerate a little to explain why because the world is full of morons, some of whom are Chicago sportswriters, who don’t understand why.”
I also think its worth noting that he was saying this as Pujols/Fielder fever was in full swing, and that he was making an effort to lower expectations and give the press something to speculate about besides “ZOMG THE CUBS WILL/WON’T GET PUJOLS!”[/quote]Agreed completely.
Gosh, I’ve got to get back to work.
Have a great day guys! Thanks for letting me drop by and offer some drive-by arguing!
Cubs_StatsQuote Reply
[quote name=work sucks]Morosi:
yes please, where do i sign[/quote]
That is an awful lot of money. He would have to be an MVP candidate every year for people to not eventually hate him. God help him if he got injured.
I’d do 5 years at $130M with the 5th year being a mutual option. Boras gets a better AAV + the possibility of another big payday after the 4th season. Cubs get Fielder for 4 years at about $100M guaranteed.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=WenningtonsGorillaCock]The Cubs bought the land across Clark St. that currently houses a McDonalds. Intention is to redevelop the plot to increase revenue. I’ve read in other publications that that McDonald’s is one of the most profitable in the country, so I can’t imagine it was cheap.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/9438507-418/cubs-buy-mcdonalds-property-across-from-wrigley-field.html%5B/quote%5D
OMFG WRIGLEY WILL BE WORTHLESS WITHOUT THE IRREPLACEABLE MCDONALDS EXPERIENCE WHAT HAS SCIENCE DONE I AM NO LONGER A CUBS FAN
fang2415Quote Reply
[quote name=work sucks]i buy shit for my wife on there with some regularity. she loves that stuff, so i just sign into her account and look on her favorites list, then go under my own account to buy it. usually means:
recalcitrant nate’s wife——> happy[/quote]Somebody should tell Recalcitrant Blogger Nate that some dude named work sucks is going on his own wife’s etsy list to get ideas in order to buy presents for Nate’s wife.
fang2415Quote Reply
[quote name=Cubs_Stats]It only matters because of injuries. The Rangers needed only 5 starts — just five combined starts — from their 6 and 7 starters. That’s absurd, and it’s a large reason why they won their division and reached the World Series. (The Rangers, IMHO, lack any real pitching depth, which is fine if you score like 50 runs per inning.)
So if pitcher No. 1 is an 8-win guy, then losing him hurts a lot less with a 2-win guy in the wings as opposed to a replacement level, 0 win guy — especially if you miss the second Wild Card spot by 1 win.[/quote]
You can’t expect teams to have a 2-win guy sitting around doing nothing and waiting for an injury.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=fang2415]OMFG WRIGLEY WILL BE WORTHLESS WITHOUT THE IRREPLACEABLE MCDONALDS EXPERIENCE WHAT HAS SCIENCE DONE I AM NO LONGER A CUBS FAN[/quote]I go to Subway.
/not a true Cubs fan
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=fang2415]Somebody should tell Recalcitrant Blogger Nate that some dude named work sucks is going on his own wife’s etsy list to get ideas in order to buy presents for Nate’s wife.[/quote]
OV became a swinger website so slowly that I never even noticed.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]That is an awful lot of money. He would have to be an MVP candidate every year for people to not eventually hate him. God help him if he got injured.
I’d do 5 years at $130M with the 5th year being a mutual option. Boras gets a better AAV + the possibility of another big payday after the 4th season. Cubs get Fielder for 4 years at about $100M guaranteed.[/quote]I’d probably do 6 years and $130 million at the most for Fielder. There’s no way I’d sign him for 4 years and $120 million.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]OV became a swinger website so slowly that I never even noticed.[/quote]
That’s where all those Pizza Hut MILF hits are coming from
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=fang2415]Somebody should tell Recalcitrant Blogger Nate that some dude named work sucks is going on his own wife’s etsy list to get ideas in order to buy presents for Nate’s wife.[/quote]
I bet it will be easy for Nate to find me since he already knows where I work……
work sucksQuote Reply
Was Nate the one who once said he would think about ACB while in bed with his wife?
GBTSQuote Reply
Hypothetical…
What’s to prevent the Cubs from posting an obscene bid for Darvish, which would force the Ham Fighters to accept it not knowing whether serious, and then the Cubs get the money back when they weren’t serious in signing Darvish, knowing that he wouldn’t mind staying in Japan anyway, thus blocking other teams from getting him this year?
Sorry for Yellonesque sentence, that’s how the logic rolls.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]Was Nate the one who once said he would think about ACB while in bed with his wife?[/quote]You don’t?
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=WenningtonsGorillaCock] so I can’t imagine it was cheap.[/quote]
I read $20 Million
Snyds01Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]You don’t?[/quote]
I think about ACB when I’m in bed with Nate’s wife too
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I think the Cubs come closer to 70 wins than 80. I won’t be surprised if they don’t even win 70. I expect them to be out of contention and we’ll see Garza, Byrd, Soto and Marshall traded. Maybe Marmol too.
This assumes the Cubs aren’t interested in Fielder.[/quote]Comment, insightful, rape, disapprove, children
fang2415Quote Reply
cunnilingus, phil spector, scat porn, chemical weapons
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]I think about ACB when I’m in bed with Nate’s wife too[/quote]
Damn it, beat me to it.
Aisle424Quote Reply
“[quote name=dylanj]i wouldnt mind wakefield[/quote][quote name=mb21]Yes. I mentioned that in the post, but I’m not sure the rotation is that bad. I think it’s above average if they keep Zambrano.[/quote]
Zambrano’s already in the best shape of his life. http://www.liderendeportes.com/Noticias/Beisbol/Zambrano–Quiero-quedarme-con-los-Cubs%E2%80%9D.aspx
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]Hypothetical…
What’s to prevent the Cubs from posting an obscene bid for Darvish, which would force the Ham Fighters to accept it not knowing whether serious, and then the Cubs get the money back when they weren’t serious in signing Darvish, knowing that he wouldn’t mind staying in Japan anyway, thus blocking other teams from getting him this year?
Sorry for Yellonesque sentence, that’s how the logic rolls.[/quote]To the best of my understanding, nothing.
Aisle424Quote Reply
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/12/reds-info-pitching-saunders-theriot-cuddyer.html
Keep him in the Central!!!
(dying Laughing)
Snyds01Quote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]Hypothetical…
What’s to prevent the Cubs from posting an obscene bid for Darvish and then selling him to Mexico?
[/quote].
AndCountingQuote Reply
(dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
Owned.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/310573/nbc-today-show-sandusky-attorney-no-plea-deal-in-works
GBTSQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]Was Nate the one who once said he would think about ACB while in bed with his wife?[/quote]
it was not
work sucksQuote Reply
[quote name=work sucks] [quote name=Snyds01]http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/12/reds-info-pitching-saunders-theriot-cuddyer.html
Keep him in the Central!!!
(dying Laughing)[/quote]
I wonder if Dusty will play him now.
Suburban kid 22Quote Reply
ah yes its almost time for the best shape of my life bullshit. I hate spring training
dylanjQuote Reply
Ryan Theriot has a world series ring. There is no justice in the world
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]Ryan Theriot has a world series ring. There is no justice in the world[/quote]
So do Corey Patterson and Mike Fontenot.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=GBTS](dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
Owned.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/310573/nbc-today-show-sandusky-attorney-no-plea-deal-in-works%5B/quote%5DWhy no follow up? He basically admitted that he waived the hearing to keep a child molester on the street. Ask him about that.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]Ryan Theriot has a world series ring. There is no justice in the world[/quote]Just wait until Tim Tebow has a Super Bowl ring.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]ah yes its almost time for the best shape of my life bullshit. I hate spring training[/quote]I wonder who will be the “X has been working out with Marlon Byrd and put on 25 lbs of muscle” guy this year.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Tebow’s little run is over this weekend. Den has been beating shitty teams or teams with major injuries. Or like the Bears teams that are a combination of both
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=fang2415]OMFG WRIGLEY WILL BE WORTHLESS WITHOUT THE IRREPLACEABLE MCDONALDS EXPERIENCE WHAT HAS SCIENCE DONE I AM NO LONGER A CUBS FAN[/quote]
Concessions at Wrigley are riddled with rat feces, so concessions dollars are down. Cubs plan to buy up every fast food outlet within 1 mile of the stadium, shut them down, then tell hungry fans it’s either a homemade bologna sandwich or $18 rat nachos.
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I wonder who will be the “X has been working out with Marlon Byrd and put on 25 lbs of muscle” guy this year.[/quote]If it’s not Campana, I give up predicting shit.
AndCountingQuote Reply
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]I think about ACB when I’m in bed with Nate’s wife too[/quote](dying laughing)
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=AndCounting]If it’s not Campana, I give up predicting shit.[/quote]Campana is going to show up to spring training weight 225 pounds. All muscle.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I wonder who will be the “X has been working out with Marlon Byrd and put on 25 lbs of muscle” guy this year.[/quote]Remember when he sad he’d leave his kids with Sandusky? Well, if I’m a journalist I’m going to ask that again and let him know that I’m willing to set up an unsupervised visit. Let’s see what he says then.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Campana is going to show up to spring training weight 225 pounds. All muscle.[/quote]He’d better. Sveum has him pencilled in as the cleanup hitter.
ACTQuote Reply
Marlon Byrd said he would leave his kids with Sandusky?
Suburban kid 22Quote Reply
Cubs paid $20m for the McDonalds property. Yikes.
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
Nick Punto ———–> Red Sox
Bafflement ———> Continuing
BerseliusQuote Reply
No putting your giant dick in your face.
Dr. Aneus TaintQuote Reply
Dr. Aneus TaintQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]Nick Punto ———–> Red Sox
Bafflement ———> Continuing[/quote]Trying to up their grindiscrapgrittitude so Tawmmy from Puxatawny doesn’t start yelling at them.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Dr. Aneus Taint]
[/quote]I’m actually angry I never thought of this.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Where Have You Gone Andy Van Slyke]$3.5 million for two years of Nick Punto? Man, that team paying Clint Barmes $10 million for two years sure looks dumb now. Oh, wait. Crap.[/quote]
(dying laughing)
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I’m actually angry I never thought of this.[/quote]
Delete this comment and pretend like you didn’t visit this site today.
Dr. Aneus TaintQuote Reply
http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php/option=com_altcaster/task=viewaltcast/altcast_code=4deac24c7e/height=550/width=470
Interesting…….
Snyds01Quote Reply
[quote name=Snyds01]http://www.coveritlive.com/index2.php/option=com_altcaster/task=viewaltcast/altcast_code=4deac24c7e/height=550/width=470
Interesting…….[/quote]
Considering that the bidding window is still open for another hour, probably meaningless.
BerseliusQuote Reply
Damn you Snyds. I’ll make sure you’ll pay this weekend in the OV Fantasy Football league.
WaLiQuote Reply
[quote name=WaLi]Damn you Snyds. I’ll make sure you’ll pay this weekend in the OV Fantasy Football league.[/quote]
I already got my revenge on VaG for a regular season last minute win when we had the highest two scores, so bring it on
Snyds01Quote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]Nick Punto ———–> Red Sox
Bafflement ———> Continuing[/quote]Maybe the “significant” return they’re looking for is Jeff Samardzija.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]Considering that the bidding window is still open for another hour, probably meaningless.[/quote]I assume the guy is just making shit up.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Snyds01]I already got my revenge on VaG for a regular season last minute win when we had the highest two scores, so bring it on[/quote]
GodTim Tebow will lead my team to victory.WaLiQuote Reply
http://www.howsoonafterthewindowcloseswillweknowwhowonthedarvishbiddingwar.com
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]www.howsoonafterthewindowcloseswillweknowwhowonthedarvishbiddingwar.com[/quote]www.probablyrightaway.com/butwerenotsure.hmtl
GBTSQuote Reply
[quote name=WaLi]
GodTim Tebow will lead my team to victory.[/quote]Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]www.probablyrightaway.com/butwerenotsure.hmtl[/quote]www.thanksthatiswhatithought.eu
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Maybe the “significant” return they’re looking for is Jeff Samardzija.[/quote]
The Cubs should just send them Micah Hoffpauir and Matt Murton and see if they notice.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]www.probablyrightaway.com/butwerenotsure.hmtl[/quote]
http://www.whatisthisfancynewhmtlprotocal.com/pissingonyourcurtains.jsp
BerseliusQuote Reply
Snyds01Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Maybe the “significant” return they’re looking for is Jeff Samardzija.[/quote]
Maybe they wanted Koyie Hill to replace Varitek’s gritty leadership.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]www.probablyrightaway.com/butwerenotsure.hmtl[/quote]If you don’t change that to .html it won’t work.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]www.thanksthatiswhatithought.eu[/quote]www.startinginjanuaryyoucanregisterextensionslike.bleedcubbieblue
mb21Quote Reply
http://www.whatistheworstmemetoeveryhappenonthisblog.edu/thisone.jpg
GBTSQuote Reply
So, does the silence mean the Cubs are bidding, or not?
It could go either way.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]So, does the silence mean the Cubs are bidding, or not?
It could go either way.[/quote]
Local media will report the result sometime in April.
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
The Score is reading a report that says the Wrigley remodel is going to cost 400 mil
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]So, does the silence mean the Cubs are bidding, or not?
It could go either way.[/quote]
What’s the over/under on that?
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]What’s the over/under on that?[/quote]Space shuttle.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]What’s the over/under on that?[/quote]Yes.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]The Score is reading a report that says the Wrigley remodel is going to cost 400 mil[/quote]Wasn’t that what they said a year or so ago when the Ricketts first tried to get money from the city/state?
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]Wasn’t that what they said a year or so ago when the Ricketts first tried to get money from the city/state?[/quote]I think they were saying 2-3 at that time, but MB and a couple others here were adamant that those numbers had to be wrong. Seems like the Cubs are finally saying the same thing.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
http://www.dorkly.com/article/26731/the-nine-greatest-nerd-fears-today
Yes and Yes to numbers 8 and 7
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]http://www.dorkly.com/article/26731/the-nine-greatest-nerd-fears-today
Yes and Yes to numbers 8 and 7[/quote]My kid has seen all the Star Wars movies and does not have a clear favorite. I think he likes Episode VI just slightly more than the rest because of the Ewoks and the Death Star blowing up again, though. We almost never watch Episodes I or II and the only prequel in the regular rotation is Episode III.
/cool nerd story bro
Rice CubeQuote Reply
My wife would also absolutely flip shit if they made a US Doctor Who. She already cried when David Tennant left the show and is still trying to get used to Matt Smith.
/cool nerd wife story bro
Rice CubeQuote Reply
I think Yu Darvish broke Twitter.
GBTSQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]I think Yu Darvish broke Twitter.[/quote]No, it’s not what you think. Twitter just has herpes.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]www.whatistheworstmemetoeveryhappenonthisblog.edu/thisone.jpg[/quote]www.fuckyu.gov
mb21Quote Reply
(dying laughing)
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]http://www.dorkly.com/article/26731/the-nine-greatest-nerd-fears-today
Yes and Yes to numbers 8 and 7[/quote]
Don’t get me started ((dying laughing)). I’ll add #9 to my personal list too.
MishQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I think they were saying 2-3 at that time, but MB and a couple others here were adamant that those numbers had to be wrong. Seems like the Cubs are finally saying the same thing.[/quote]
The Ricketts were asking for $200-250M from the state and saying they would put up $200M of their own. Are they now saying they will need $400M and STILL put up $200M? That is probably about right considering what needs to happen and the current costs of construction.
Aisle424Quote Reply
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]The Ricketts were asking for $200-250M from the state and saying they would put up $200M of their own. Are they now saying they will need $400M and STILL put up $200M? That is probably about right considering what needs to happen and the current costs of construction.[/quote]That’s how I understand it. 400 mil AND “substantial” public funds.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Are they going to put something behind the center field wall that lights up every time someone hits a home run?
ACTQuote Reply
Maybe a cage with live bear cubs would be in order.
ACTQuote Reply
Apparently part of the deal to buy the land the Cubs bought is that the McDonald’s is to remain on that site and the Cubs will put a merch tent there next season.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Apparently part of the deal to buy the land the Cubs bought is that the McDonald’s is to remain on that site and the Cubs will put a merch tent there next season.[/quote]$20 million for a t-shirt stall?
What is this I don’t even
Suburban kid 22Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Apparently part of the deal to buy the land the Cubs bought is that the McDonald’s is to remain on that site and the Cubs will put a merch tent there next season.[/quote]that’s a lot of Horry Kow shirts they’ll need to sell
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Apparently part of the deal to buy the land the Cubs bought is that the McDonald’s is to remain on that site and the Cubs will put a merch tent there next season.[/quote]
That makes no sense at all. Maybe the agreement is that a McDonald’s location has to remain as part of whatever is put there. Maybe they build a large building with a bunch of stuff that takes our money that also happens to include a McD’s on the 1st floor.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Apparently part of the deal to buy the land the Cubs bought is that the McDonald’s is to remain on that site and the Cubs will put a merch tent there next season.[/quote]I AM A CUBS FAN AGAI-
Wait, what?
fang2415Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]That makes no sense at all. Maybe the agreement is that a McDonald’s location has to remain as part of whatever is put there. Maybe they build a large building with a bunch of stuff that takes our money that also happens to include a McD’s on the 1st floor.[/quote]I think that’s the plan. But that better be one sweetassed merch tent next season. (dying laughing)
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Moral of the McDonald’s story: Theo can’t keep the Rickettses from doing strange things.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I think that’s the plan. But that better be one sweetassed merch tent next season. (dying laughing)[/quote]They’d make more money if they just kept the parking revenues.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Moral of the McDonald’s story: Theo can’t keep Crane from doing strange things.[/quote].
Aisle424Quote Reply
Maybe keeping the McDonald’s is part of Fielder’s proposed contract.
GBTSQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]Maybe keeping the McDonald’s is part of Fielder’s proposed contract.[/quote]I.e his new living quarters.
MishQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]Maybe keeping the McDonald’s is part of Fielder’s proposed contract.[/quote]It’s their way of getting some of his money back.
ACTQuote Reply
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]
[/quote](dying laughing)
(dying laughing)
MishQuote Reply
http://isittimeforabeer.com/
WenningtonsGorillaCockQuote Reply
Phil Rogers sez the Cubs did bid on Darvish.
GBTSQuote Reply
The Score says the Cubs are not believed to be “among the highest bidders” Rangers, Nationals, and Yanks were among the teams believed to have bid higher than the Cubs.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]The Score says the Cubs are not believed to be “among the highest bidders” Rangers, Nationals, and Yanks were among the teams believed to have bid higher than the Cubs.[/quote]I’ll believe it when it’s officially official.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=ACT]It’s their way of getting some of his money back.[/quote](dying laughing)
mb21Quote Reply
It would be awesome if the Cubs signed Fielder and included in his contract was a clause that he couldn’t eat fast food.
mb21Quote Reply
I’ve been reading about teams not bidding on Darvish. Why would a team not bid on him? That makes no sense. Even if you are 99.999% sure you don’t have the highest bid, maybe the highest bids actually get lost.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]The Score says the Cubs are not believed to be “among the highest bidders” Rangers, Nationals, and Yanks were among the teams believed to have bid higher than the Cubs.[/quote]
Same old Cubs.
Smokestack LightningQuote Reply
everything is see on twitter says Tor and the Cubs put in massive bids on Darvish.
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]Phil Rogers sez the Cubs did bid on Darvish.[/quote]
They plan to pay in McDonald’s cheeseburgers.
RodrigoQuote Reply
[quote name=Rodrigo]They plan to pay in McDonald’s cheeseburgers.[/quote]That’s as good as gold!
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I’ve been reading about teams not bidding on Darvish. Why would a team not bid on him? That makes no sense. Even if you are 99.999% sure you don’t have the highest bid, maybe the highest bids actually get lost.[/quote]I’d put in the bid regardless. If not serious, just pretend to negotiate with the player and get the posting fee back when the talks break down. Though I have no idea if there are safeguards against that. The posting system is stupid.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
i would think that the Yankees will be in on this. they have been pretty quiet
dylanjQuote Reply
[quote name=dylanj]everything is see on twitter says Tor and the Cubs put in massive bids on Darvish.[/quote]That’s likely true. But that doesn’t mean there weren’t more massive ones.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Olney quotes “3 MLB execs” who pegged the Jays and Rangers as the favorites for Darvish.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
http://tomarayascream.com/
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Good news: Zambrano game is scheduled to be on espn3.
Bad news: Game is being delayed by rain.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]
Maybe keeping the McDonald’s is part of Fielder’s proposed contract.
[/quote]
WE ALREADY DISCUSSED THIS
[quote name=Berselius]This could also be a complicated gambit to lure Prince Fielder. Or they could replace it with a Popeye’s and try to get Josh Beckett’s interest[/quote].
Rob G.Quote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]I’ll believe it when it’s officially official.[/quote]
I’ll believe it when some non-Chicago writer has some info on the cubs bid/non-bid
BerseliusQuote Reply
Ham Fighters are apparently seeing $$$ signs. Bid was a nice hefty one.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]The Score says the Cubs are not believed to be “among the highest bidders” Rangers, Nationals, and Yanks were among the teams believed to have bid higher than the Cubs.[/quote]
Olney sez Yankees did not bid
BerseliusQuote Reply
OK espn3 is now showing the game. Tarp is still on field.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]Ham Fighters are apparently seeing $$$ signs. Bid was a nice hefty one.[/quote]I would guess $50 million, but that’s based on what the bid for Fukudome was. He’s the only other player like Darvish to compare to. Actually, this is more like Strasburg or Harper. There’s never been a Darvish before.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]Olney sez Yankees did not bid[/quote]What that means is that they bid about $30 million. (dying laughing)
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I would guess $50 million, but that’s based on what the bid for Fukudome was. He’s the only other player like Darvish to compare to. Actually, this is more like Strasburg or Harper. There’s never been a Darvish before.[/quote]I thought Fukudome was a free agent.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
Olney says the Yankees DID bid.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]I thought Fukudome was a free agent.[/quote](dying laughing) I meant Matsuzaka.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21](dying laughing) I meant Matsuzaka.[/quote]Well, y’know, they all look alike…
/Asian joke
Rice CubeQuote Reply
It would have been positively bizarre if the Yankees did not bid.
ACTQuote Reply
http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/index.php/site/comments/can_the_victim_of_abuse_be_an_enabler/
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=ACT]It would have been positively bizarre if the Yankees did not bid.[/quote]I don’t believe all of these “did not bid” comments. I believe 30 teams bid on Yu Darvish. I also believe 20 of them were nothing more than submitting an offer in case every other team forgets to. I believe another 5 were reasonable bids and 5 others were significant offers.
mb21Quote Reply
Rice CubeQuote Reply
I do not believe the Cubs were one of the significant offers. I would guess they were in the reasonable offer group. I also believe they’ll be in that group with Cespedes and Fielder, but come nowhere close to the best offer for any of them.
mb21Quote Reply
Of all the days it could rain in Venezuela, it has to be the day Zambrano is pitching on ESPN. Oy.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I do not believe the Cubs were one of the significant offers. I would guess they were in the reasonable offer group. I also believe they’ll be in that group with Cespedes and Fielder, but come nowhere close to the best offer for any of them.[/quote]Well that’s a funsucker. If that’s true then I guess they really are going to punt 2012.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=ACT]Of all the days it could rain in Venezuela, it has to be the day Zambrano is pitching on ESPN. Oy.[/quote]Z needed more time to chase the chicken around while Mick yells at him to eat lightning and crap thunder.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Olney says the Yankees DID bid.[/quote]
Berselius can’t read (dying laughing). It was mixed in with a list of teams that didn’t bid.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]Berselius can’t read (dying laughing). It was mixed in with a list of teams that didn’t bid.[/quote]That’s OK. I keep mixing up a bunch of Asian names. At least Ichrio is around to remind me.
mb21Quote Reply
Since the Red Sox have gone all stupid on us, maybe we could trade Darwin Barney for Dustin Pedroia.
mb21Quote Reply
(dying laughing) of course they do. That’s why they posted him. Has any team ever declined the posting fee?
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Since the Red Sox have gone all stupid on us, maybe we could trade Darwin Barney for Dustin Pedroia.[/quote]Ask them to cover the salary difference, too.
ACTQuote Reply
Really, though, all vertically-challenged, light-skinned second basemen are alike.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=ACT]Ask them to cover the salary difference, too.[/quote]
Rice CubeQuote Reply
Can you guys name a few sites where you get a lot of your funny pictures?
Need helpQuote Reply
Pulling tarp off field.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=Need help]Can you guys name a few sites where you get a lot of your funny pictures?[/quote]
http://www.gocomics.com/peanuts
GWQuote Reply
[quote name=Need help]Can you guys name a few sites where you get a lot of your funny pictures?[/quote]Any specific images that you can think of?
mb21Quote Reply
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/12/cubs-dodgers-interested-in-coco-crisp.html
mb21Quote Reply
Can he play third base?
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=Need help]Can you guys name a few sites where you get a lot of your funny pictures?[/quote]
Google.com
Aisle424Quote Reply
Um… our comment message is erroneous. I submitted a bid of $100 for Darvish because, what the hell…
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Any specific images that you can think of?[/quote]
GWQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]Um… our comment message is erroneous. I submitted a bid of $100 for Darvish because, what the hell…[/quote]My bad. I fixed it.
mb21Quote Reply
Z’s game is finally starting.
ACTQuote Reply
New comment?
Rice CubeQuote Reply
Ha!
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Any specific images that you can think of?[/quote]
I like the ones you guys post with the funny quotes. Wish I could describe it better.
Need helpQuote Reply
Yay! I’m watching Zambrano pitch! Just like old times.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]Google.com[/quote]
Hmm, tell me more about this Google?
Need helpQuote Reply
Z K’s the first batter swinging.
ACTQuote Reply
[quote name=Need help]Hmm, tell me more about this Google?[/quote]It’s kind of like Alta Vista, Pawnee resident.
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Need help]I like the ones you guys post with the funny quotes. Wish I could describe it better.[/quote]The facebook ones?
mb21Quote Reply
new shit: http://obstructedview.net/chicago-cubs/projections/cairos-extremely-early-projected-standings.html
mb21Quote Reply