There are two basic schools of thought about Mike Quade’s recent comments on Carlos Silva: 1) Mike Quade is the greatest, toughest, smartest son of a gun in baseball; 2) Mike Quade is a verbose, no good, sucker-punching fool. There is no in between. Of course there is still only one school of thought on Carlos Silva: he’s fat ugly, mean, and terrible at baseball.
I guess I’m a little slow, because I don’t understand what got Quade’s scalp all smudged. Let’s take another look at what has been said of late, and let’s see if we can get to the bottom of who’s the awesome stud and who is loco. Here’s what Silva said after the announcement that Andrew Cashner would be the team’s 5th starter and Silva was invited to invest in rentals in Iowa a half hour after he was told he was pitching well:
“I’m like, if you have to say something, be straight,” Silva said. “[Cubs pitching coach Mark Riggins] has to learn he’s in the big leagues now. There are no kids around here. . . . The way he laid it out, it was like, I don’t know what he was trying to do.
“He was like ‘Man, you’ve been throwing the ball good, you can pitch, all of that, blah, blah, blah. If you go out there to Triple-A and throw some games to continue building, to continue getting better.’ I was like, ‘I don’t need to go there. I’m ready to go. I feel good and I’m ready to pitch.’
“Then he told me there was not going to be a spot in the rotation or in the bullpen either. He should have started with that first, and then say you’re strong (throwing) in the bullpen.”
“Say what you have to say and say it,” he said. “Don’t say people are competing for a spot because it wasn’t true. Nobody was competing for a spot. They already had their rotation done. It was very clear.”
I emphasized that last part because I hope it was true. But all in all, it’s not at all shocking. It’s a classic example of someone who copes with the reception of bad news by blaming the messenger and the method of delivery. I would have felt better about losing the lottery if the spokesmodel wasn’t so smiley about it. Or I wish you would have told me sooner or You couldn’t have waited for a better time to tell me? And my personal favorite, Following the Cubs would be a lot less depressing if it wasn’t for the crappy beat writers. We all do it. Carlos shouldn’t be proud of his comments, but they weren’t that bad.
Then we got Jim Hendry’s reaction to Silva complaining about how he was informed he was out of a job:
“Obviously, we’re dealing with a man that at this particular point in his career is not willing to face the facts, that what he’s done the last few years, except for a two-month period, is well below major league standards and who seems to have the continual problem of blaming everybody but himself.
Basically, he wasn’t good enough to make the team. You factor in not only spring training, but you try to go back and factor in the second half last year, and you’re looking at a guy that had a 14-something ERA from July 11 on and that came to camp with the notion that he already had a spot in the rotation. . . . I won’t tolerate it.
Okay, Jim. You brought Carlos to justice for not being happy about getting fired. As someone who will never get fired, I guess we shouldn’t expect you to understand. That’s cool. Now let’s hear what Mike Quade has to say.
Carlos is dead wrong about Mark Riggins. He does not, apparently, need to learn he’s in the big leagues now. Or something. Whatever it was, he’s dead wrong about it. With cuss-word emphasis! I get the need to defend the guys on your coaching staff, but . . . against the dude you just cut from the team? Really? Look at this video and tell me honestly, who in this whole scenario sounds more like Charlie Sheen?
Quade gets my vote. Personally, I’m a fan of how Mark Riggins handled it. You know, the boring, this-won’t-make-headlines way:
“Carlos has his opinion, and I’ll leave it at that. I try to stay positive with everything. It’s water under the bridge. It happens. I understand the emotions that go with things. I’ll make no comment on [whether Silva apologized]. This game gives people a lot of character. Most people in baseball are very successful once they leave the game. And so I wish him the best, and if I can help him in any way, the door’s always open.”
Not burning bridges? Grace? Respect when it’s not necessarily earned? Dignity? Fire Riggins now. He clearly doesn’t fit in.
Comments
Nicely done.
MishQuote Reply
Thanks. Practically speaking, this might help team chemistry in the short run. But I don’t think it really sets the stage for a team that will handle adversity in anything resembling a professional manner. If Quade gets this upset when the people he cuts don’t like him, how is he going to do when the media is pissing all over his every bunting decision?
AndCountingQuote Reply
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AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=AndCounting]Thanks. Practically speaking, this might help team chemistry in the short run. But I don’t think it really sets the stage for a team that will handle adversity in anything resembling a professional manner. If Quade gets this upset when the people he cuts don’t like him, how is he going to do when the media is pissing all over his every bunting decision?[/quote]
I hope he throws things.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
[quote name=AndCounting]Thanks. Practically speaking, this might help team chemistry in the short run. But I don’t think it really sets the stage for a team that will handle adversity in anything resembling a professional manner. If Quade gets this upset when the people he cuts don’t like him, how is he going to do when the media is pissing all over his every bunting decision?[/quote]Yeah, Quade came off real defensive in that clip. I think he felt bad for Riggins, and that’s what the over-defensive “this is on me” bit was about. Hendry’s and Quade’s responses both seemed way more than necessary (not that anything was really necessary), which does suggest there might have been a lot more bad blood with Silva than just this incident. Maybe they were reacting to a year’s worth of frustration, and not just Silva’s parting media interview. Still not professional.
Suburban kidQuote Reply
Without being specific to this instance, the Cubs to have a track record of speaking ill of past players, don’t they? I’m sure that factors into some players’ minds when dealing with Hendry.
HarryQuote Reply
This site is much more user friendly on the smartphones than ACB. God job tech .erds
bubblesdachimpQuote Reply
I agree 100% with this. I’m not upset that any of this happened. Silva is going to be disappointed and upset that he lost a job and it’s not unnatural to take it out on the people that you feel are responsible. Then it’s just typical behavior that one wants to defend himself from the criticism.
I’m just reminded of that dugout issue the Brewers had a couple years ago. That stuff happens all the time. The media tried to blow it out of proportion, but the Brewers wouldn’t let them. It was an internal matter and none of our business. They told us to go away. They were confident enough that they could handle it and didn’t want to make it worse by making it more of a story than it was.
Then you look at the Cubs and how they handle such situations. It’s the exact opposite. Rather than dealing with it themselves, they make threats to the media about this or that. Then it’s a story that you have to respond to.
Sometimes it’s just better to not say anything. As much as that was true of Milton Bradley, it’s also true of the organization itself. We can’t reasonably criticize Milton Bradley for voicing his opinion every other day and then applaud the Cubs for voicing their’s every other day. It’s none of my business. It’s none of your business. Keep it between themselves and work out it in a less public manner.
I’m in the middle here. I don’t have a problem with Silva said at all. He shouldn’t have said it, but he’s human and under those circumstances we expect that response. The Cubs shouldn’t have said anything either, but they’re also human and once you respond to it you have to continue to respond it. I’d just like the team to resist that urge to respond. Say something like, “it’s not as much of an issue as most think. We’ve moved on already.”
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=bubblesdachimp]This site is much more user friendly on the smartphones than ACB. God job tech .erds[/quote]I know it works nicely on the iphone, but I haven’t been able to test it on anything else. What are you using?
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Suburban Kid]Hendry’s and Quade’s responses both seemed way more than necessary (not that anything was really necessary), which does suggest there might have been a lot more bad blood with Silva than just this incident. Maybe they were reacting to a year’s worth of frustration, and not just Silva’s parting media interview. Still not professional.[/quote]I’m sure you’re right. They must have been fed up for awhile.
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=Harry]Without being specific to this instance, the Cubs to have a track record of speaking ill of past players, don’t they? I’m sure that factors into some players’ minds when dealing with Hendry.[/quote]That could be, but I think this was more of an instance where Silva just said stuff that he probably later regretted. Maybe not.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Harry]Without being specific to this instance, the Cubs to have a track record of speaking ill of past players, don’t they? I’m sure that factors into some players’ minds when dealing with Hendry.[/quote]
Among other things, but I am pretty sure that’s one of a myriad of reasons some players don’t want to play for the Cubs.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
It would certainly make sense that this has been an issue that’s been boiling over for awhile. I’d just prefer the Cubs handle this away from the media. The Cubs said all they had to when they didn’t add Silva to the roster. They should have let that action by itself do the talking.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I know it works nicely on the iphone, but I haven’t been able to test it on anything else. What are you using?[/quote]Deoid samsung galaxy x… Amazing!
Anyome else following the bonds trial?
bubblesdachimpQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]It would certainly make sense that this has been an issue that’s been boiling over for awhile. I’d just prefer the Cubs handle this away from the media. The Cubs said all they had to when they didn’t add Silva to the roster. They should have let that action by itself do the talking.[/quote]Yeah, they cut him, they released him, what else do they need to say?
I think it was Jon Daniels from the Rangers who got interviewed during the game on Saturday. They asked him about the Michael Young situation, and he just downplayed everything and said it was too bad that people ripped into Young. He’s probably still trying to trade him, but he handled it really well and said nothing more than he needed to. I was pretty impressed.
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=bubblesdachimp]Deoid samsung galaxy x… Amazing!
Anyome else following the bonds trial?[/quote]I was for a little while. Then I saw they were talking about his nut size and I decided to move on. I don’t care how bit or little his nuts are.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I was for a little while. Then I saw they were talking about his nut size and I decided to move on. I don’t care how bit or little his nuts are.[/quote]All I know is Maris had the truly greatest nuts.
GBTSQuote Reply
[quote name=GBTS]All I know is Maris had the truly greatest nuts.[/quote]That’s nuts.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Rice Cube]Among other things, but I am pretty sure that’s one of a myriad of reasons some players don’t want to play for the Cubs.[/quote]
The Cubs clearly have their favorites. Some of their former players they treat very well and do favors for (Maddux, Lilly, Wood); some of them they don’t (Bradley, Sosa, Silva).
Personally, I don’t have a problem with the way they have treated Silva because I pretty much feel the same way. It probably would have been more professional to have just let Silva’s comments slide. But, after dealing with his shit all spring and probably last summer, I can’t completely blame them for ripping him publicly and defending their pitching coach.
Hector VillanuevaQuote Reply
Yeah, HV, I don’t necessarily blame them. I just think there’s a much more professional way to handle these situations than the Cubs tend to do. That’s really my only complaint with has happened here. I think AC may be right in that it could build up chemistry so it’s possible that’s one reason it was done.
mb21Quote Reply
Where does this come in? Do players really not want to play for the Cubs? If Ben Gordon can leave the Bulls for the Pistons (not that I mind, it’s just an example), doesn’t that show that players just go where the most money is? I seem to recall seeing most players with 5-and-10 options DON’T block the Cubs as a destination.
[quote name=Rice Cube]Among other things, but I am pretty sure that’s one of a myriad of reasons some players don’t want to play for the Cubs.[/quote]
Steve SwisherQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]
I’m just reminded of that dugout issue the Brewers had a couple years ago. That stuff happens all the time. The media tried to blow it out of proportion, but the Brewers wouldn’t let them. It was an internal matter and none of our business. They told us to go away. They were confident enough that they could handle it and didn’t want to make it worse by making it more of a story than it was.
[/quote]
Yup – you can also look at last year when BJ Upton and Evan Longoria had a dugout fight just a week or two after the Zambrano/Lee scuffle. The dynamics were pretty the same, the clubhouse good guy (Longoria) and the unfairly-portrayed-but-valuable-contributor (Upton) getting into it. The Rays handled it internally, Maddon said something along the lines “they are grown ass men – they talked about it and its over” and it didn’t come up again. Compare that to dinnergate here.
MishQuote Reply
[quote name=Steve Swisher]Where does this come in? Do players really not want to play for the Cubs? If Ben Gordon can leave the Bulls for the Pistons (not that I mind, it’s just an example), doesn’t that show that players just go where the most money is? I seem to recall seeing most players with 5-and-10 options DON’T block the Cubs as a destination.[/quote]
I think it’s really hard to tell where players do and do not want to play. Because money is generally the first priority, players do not want to burn bridges at a future destination that may give them the most dollars. It would be stupid for them to go on record saying they don’t want to play at Wrigley even if finances being equal they would not want to play there.
Hector VillanuevaQuote Reply
[quote name=Steve Swisher]Where does this come in? Do players really not want to play for the Cubs? If Ben Gordon can leave the Bulls for the Pistons (not that I mind, it’s just an example), doesn’t that show that players just go where the most money is? I seem to recall seeing most players with 5-and-10 options DON’T block the Cubs as a destination.[/quote]Jake Peavy refused a trade to come here, and Torii Hunter has had the Cubs contractually excluded as a trade destination for some time, for two recent examples. Some digging could probably find more.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
I’d say almost every player goes where the money is, but we do have some evidence that some players want to avoid playing for the Cubs. Specifically black ballplayers.
I agree with you for the most part though. A player is going to sign where the most money is offered, but it’s at least concerning to me that Torii Hunter put the Cubs on his no-trade list several years ago because of the racism issue. That was actually before his good friend Jack Jones came to Chicago so I’m sure he was further convinced it was a good idea. If it’s that important to Hunter, you know there are others.
My guess is that when a GM hands someone a contract that it’s almost always for the most money that they probably feel more than welcomed.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Manni Stats]Yup – you can also look at last year when BJ Upton and Evan Longoria had a dugout fight just a week or two after the Zambrano/Lee scuffle. The dynamics were pretty the same, the clubhouse good guy (Longoria) and the unfairly-portrayed-but-valuable-contributor (Upton) getting into it. The Rays handled it internally, Maddon said something along the lines “they are grown ass men – they talked about it and its over” and it didn’t come up again. Compare that to dinnergate here.[/quote]I smell a Quade-Hendry-Ricketts “Mean Girls” movie poster mashup coming…
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Isn’t this all under the assumption that other things were not said in private that pissed off Quade and Hendry?
Who cares if they went off on Silva really? The important thing is that they got rid of him and are giving Cashner the rotation spot.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Steve Swisher]Where does this come in? Do players really not want to play for the Cubs? If Ben Gordon can leave the Bulls for the Pistons (not that I mind, it’s just an example), doesn’t that show that players just go where the most money is? I seem to recall seeing most players with 5-and-10 options DON’T block the Cubs as a destination.[/quote]
I do recall Torii Hunter saying he wouldn’t play for the Cubs, because of issues with the fans. That’s the only one I got on the top off my head.
MishQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I’d say almost every player goes where the money is, but we do have some evidence that some players want to avoid playing for the Cubs. Specifically black ballplayers.
I agree with you for the most part though. A player is going to sign where the most money is offered, but it’s at least concerning to me that Torii Hunter put the Cubs on his no-trade list several years ago because of the racism issue. That was actually before his good friend Jack Jones came to Chicago so I’m sure he was further convinced it was a good idea. If it’s that important to Hunter, you know there are others.
My guess is that when a GM hands someone a contract that it’s almost always for the most money that they probably feel more than welcomed.[/quote]
Though I’m sure Torii’s ex-teammate LaTroy Hawkins gave him the down low.
MishQuote Reply
I’m sure things happened privately. I don’t blame anyone in this. My only issue is that these things don’t seem to happen as regularly with other clubs. Most teams keep these types of matters away from the public. Maybe every team would have responded to Silva. That’s entirely possible. I can’t say one way or the other, but cutting the guy is all the Cubs had to say. It’s really not much different than spitting in someone’s face. You usually won’t see someone who did that further explain his actions. He just disrespected someone in about the worst way.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Isn’t this all under the assumption that other things were not said in private that pissed off Quade and Hendry?
Who cares if they went off on Silva really? The important thing is that they got rid of him and are giving Cashner the rotation spot.[/quote]Isn’t this under the assumption that there were things said in private that pissed off Quade and Hendry?
Sure it’s good that Silva is gone, but the Cubs are behaving like idiots. Cub fans thrash Ozzie for doing the exact same things. Just because we agree with the results doesn’t mean we have to be myopic about them.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
To me, it just feels like you’re kicking Silva when he’s already down. Like I said though, maybe other teams do this when players mouth off. I really don’t know.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I’m sure things happened privately. I don’t blame anyone in this. My only issue is that these things don’t seem to happen as regularly with other clubs. Most teams keep these types of matters away from the public. Maybe every team would have responded to Silva. That’s entirely possible. I can’t say one way or the other, but cutting the guy is all the Cubs had to say. It’s really not much different than spitting in someone’s face. You usually won’t see someone who did that further explain his actions. He just disrespected someone in about the worst way.[/quote]Exactly. Releasing a guy getting paid 11.5 mil was all the smackdown the Cubs needed to lay. That sends a clear message to the whole league that the guy is a problem both on the field and off it. All the kvetching from Baldy McGrindy and Jimbo the Drunken Gym Teacher On A Booze Cruise is simply overkill; releasing the guy was the biggest insult they could pay him.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]To me, it just feels like you’re kicking Silva when he’s already down. Like I said though, maybe other teams do this when players mouth off. I really don’t know.[/quote]The White Sox do it with regularity, and Cub fans delight in ridiculing them for it. People in glass houses…
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Isn’t this under the assumption that there were things said in private that pissed off Quade and Hendry?
Sure it’s good that Silva is gone, but the Cubs are behaving like idiots. Cub fans thrash Ozzie for doing the exact same things. Just because we agree with the results doesn’t mean we have to be myopic about them.[/quote]
I never said be myopic about it. However, I don’t have a problem with being outspoken at all, even with Ozzie. My problem with Ozzie is that he talks shit about guys on his team. I really couldn’t care less if he wants to talk shit about people that are gone, like Quade did with Silva. When the Silva thing happened with Rammy, it was handled exactly how it should be, quietly.
Now that Silva is gone, who gives a crap what anybody says about it? And more than anything, I think what was said is good for Cashner. It feels like they’re standing behind him as their guy. Takes away some of the pressure.
Could it be handled better? Yes. But who cares what anybody says about people that aren’t even on the team anymore? And pretty much everyone alive knows that mutual dislike can bring people together. There are probably quite a few people on the team that really don’t like Silva, Ramirez for example, letting everybody know that Quade thinks he’s a POS and his ass being gone isn’t going to do anything except make them like him.
DoogolasQuote Reply
I like how AC put it in the post and it needed to be said, but I kind of feel like further discussing it justifies the Cubs actions.
I don’t have any idea what went on behind closed doors. It’s possible Silva was sleeping with the player’s wives.
I just wish they’d handled it differently and I also wish Silva handled it differently. We have two human natural responses so it doesn’t bother me that much. But I think there’s a better and more professional way of handling it. That’s all I have to say.
mb21Quote Reply
Doug, excellent point about how the Silva/Ramirez situation was handled. It was handled quietly. it was the media that tried to make it more of a story and the Cubs didn’t allow it. Excellent point.
mb21Quote Reply
Oh, good, meaningless platitudes about motivation.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
Also, on it happening with other clubs, how so? Have you, or anyone really, actually looked into it? We all follow the Cubs very closely, but I’d be willing to bet that this happens plenty with other teams. But to people that don’t follow those teams, we just don’t give a crap or pay any attention to it.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Oh, good, meaningless platitudes about motivation.[/quote]Thing is, I think it could motivate them.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Doug, excellent point about how the Silva/Ramirez situation was handled. It was handled quietly. it was the media that tried to make it more of a story and the Cubs didn’t allow it. Excellent point.[/quote]Yeah, it’s strange that they took the high road there and just couldn’t now, though. Quade really talks too much. He just needs to learn some things are best left unsaid.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Oh, good, meaningless platitudes about motivation.[/quote]
If you’re referring to me, when did I say anything about motivation? All I said was that it is a fact that mutual hatred brings people together. I never said it was motivation for anyone. Nor did I say it would motivate Cashner. Only that it’s nice that they’re showing confidence in standing behind their decision to make him the 5th starter publicly. I like that. It’s not going to make Cashner perform better, but anybody that gets stood behind publicly is probably going to feel pretty decently.
What I mean is, for Cashner it’s like, “Cool, Quade will stand up for me if stuff happens.” Furthermore, now, I’m almost certain Cashner won’t be asked about what Silva said. Keeps the spotlight and questions and attention on everyone else and off of him.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Isn’t this all under the assumption that other things were not said in private that pissed off Quade and Hendry?
Who cares if they went off on Silva really? The important thing is that they got rid of him and are giving Cashner the rotation spot.[/quote]One of the reasons I sarcastically said there was no middle ground on the reactions is because I’m pretty much with mb that I have a middle-ground opinion. I don’t think it’s the worst thing ever said, nor has it made me fall in love with Quade. I’ve heard a lot of people who absolutely love this.
I could understand it more if Silva had really exploded and railed against the team over just being sent to the bullpen. But being demoted to the minors (while the right move) is something he wasn’t ever going to handle well. I just didn’t think what Silva said called for a major reaction.
It’s not a big deal at all to me. I just think it’s not a good sign of what’s to come, either. I wish they had downplayed it and moved on. So of course I called attention to it and refuse to let go. (dying laughing)
AndCountingQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Also, on it happening with other clubs, how so? Have you, or anyone really, actually looked into it? We all follow the Cubs very closely, but I’d be willing to bet that this happens plenty with other teams. But to people that don’t follow those teams, we just don’t give a crap or pay any attention to it.[/quote]Well, if you notice up in the thread, MB pointed to instances with the Brewers and the Rays where these types of things were handled much better. OTOH, LaRussa couldn’t help but take shots at Edmonds a couple years ago. It’s definitely not confined to the Cubs, but that doesn’t make it any less juvenile.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
all that said, I’d bet everything I own that Andrew Cashner loved the support he was shown by the organization. He was given the job before his poor start and he was probably a bit unsure of himself. Not after that.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]If you’re referring to me, when did I say anything about motivation? All I said was that it is a fact that mutual hatred brings people together. I never said it was motivation for anyone. Nor did I say it would motivate Cashner. Only that it’s nice that they’re showing confidence in standing behind their decision to make him the 5th starter publicly. I like that. It’s not going to make Cashner perform better, but anybody that gets stood behind publicly is probably going to feel pretty decently.
What I mean is, for Cashner it’s like, “Cool, Quade will stand up for me if stuff happens.” Furthermore, now, I’m almost certain Cashner won’t be asked about what Silva said. Keeps the spotlight and questions and attention on everyone else and off of him.[/quote]Only Quade’s not sticking up for Cashner, he’s sticking up for the pitching coach. Stop shifting the goalposts.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]all that said, I’d bet everything I own that Andrew Cashner loved the support he was shown by the organization. He was given the job before his poor start and he was probably a bit unsure of himself. Not after that.[/quote]Well, it was more support of the pitching coach than of Cashner. And to be honest, even Silva was very complimentary of Cashner.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
As for whether something like this happens with other teams, I do not know. No idea to be honest and it’s one of the reasons I don’t care that much about it.
This instance the bullpen fights are really two different things. We know teams usually handle the fights internally, but the Cubs haven’t.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Only Quade’s not sticking up for Cashner, he’s sticking up for the pitching coach. Stop shifting the goalposts.[/quote]
Did you fail to see everything Quade said? He did very much stick up for Cashner. Even without directly saying it, he did. He said, “It was my decision. Not anybody else’s. (paraphrase) This was my call. My decision complete and totally. I took a look at this thing and said ‘we’re going with Cashner.’ I respect everybody’s opinion, made my decision, and done.”
That is sticking up for Cahsner and standing strong behind his decision to make him the fifth starter. It is a show of confidence and conviction in his decision.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]As for whether something like this happens with other teams, I do not know. No idea to be honest and it’s one of the reasons I don’t care that much about it.
This instance the bullpen fights are really two different things. We know teams usually handle the fights internally, but the Cubs haven’t.[/quote]As nonchalantly as most players seem to regard fights, I wonder just how many fights happen in the locker room.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Did you fail to see everything Quade said? He did very much stick up for Cashner. Even without directly saying it, he did. He said, “It was my decision. Not anybody else’s. (paraphrase) This was my call. My decision complete and totally. I took a look at this thing and said ‘we’re going with Cashner.’ I respect everybody’s opinion, made my decision, and done.”
That is sticking up for Cahsner and standing strong behind his decision to make him the fifth starter. It is a show of confidence and conviction in his decision.[/quote]Silva was also complimentary of Cashner, so we should probably be glad he spoke up, too, then.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
(dying laughing), yeah, that’s what it feels like now.
My last words on it: I don’t really care, but I think it could have been handled better by both sides. I don’t find fault with either side. Simply wish it was handled better. So I basically agree with all of you.
mb21Quote Reply
Also, I don’t know if Silva said anything about Cashner. No idea. He may very well have been complimentary of him. That really wasn’t the point. I meant he stood up for him in the decision-making process.
Nobody has to say, “Cashner didn’t do anything wrong.” Everybody knows he didn’t. But that doesn’t change the fact that it’s nice that he stood strongly behind his decision. And I still feel there’s no reason that any manager or GM or whomever else shouldn’t be able to rail the hell out of somebody no longer on the team.
If he was still with the organization this would be ridiculous. But he’s not. As long as people are still on the team these things should be handled internally. Like how it was early on in ST with Silva and Rammy. Once their gone I just don’t see the big deal.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]As nonchalantly as most players seem to regard fights, I wonder just how many fights happen in the locker room.[/quote]Probably quite a few when the team is either underpeforming or not very good. I think we’d be shocked to find out how separated the players on teams are.
mb21Quote Reply
Silva on Cashner, via Hobbiton:
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
MO made a good point about Edmonds/LaRussa. That was ridiculous at the time, but that was long after Edmonds was gone.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Well, if you notice up in the thread, MB pointed to instances with the Brewers and the Rays where these types of things were handled much better. OTOH, LaRussa couldn’t help but take shots at Edmonds a couple years ago. It’s definitely not confined to the Cubs, but that doesn’t make it any less juvenile.[/quote]
The Bonds/Kent dust-up was glossed over by the Giants as well a few years back, and that was with two of their highest profile guys. Dusty blew it off to the media and didn’t give them fodder. It went away as quickly as something as high profile like that could go away.
Aisle424Quote Reply
I’m with AC. In the grand scheme, yeah, this isn’t a huge incident, but it’s another in a long train of incidents like this from this club, and it doesn’t bode well for the future.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Silva was also complimentary of Cashner, so we should probably be glad he spoke up, too, then.[/quote]
Why is it necessary to be facetious? I never said Quade did something otherworldly. I simply said it’s good he stood strongly by his decision publicly. Good for Cashner and everybody else.
DoogolasQuote Reply
To add on to the Silva-Ramirez point, not only is Ramirez a guy the beat writers like to take shots at, but it happened at a time when the biggest ‘news’ they can usually muster is stories like “What does Reed Johnson think about the Charlie Sheen situation”
BerseliusQuote Reply
I don’t think Kent was the racist that some say. I think Berkman put it best when he said Kent hates everybody equally. I can’t imagine the kind of shit that happened between Kent and Bonds.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]MO made a good point about Edmonds/LaRussa. That was ridiculous at the time, but that was long after Edmonds was gone.[/quote]
LaRussa has had issues with lots of players. Rolen comes to mind especially. Rasmus too IIRC.
BerseliusQuote Reply
I didn’t see the Johnson/Sheen comments. Link?
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I think Berkman put it best when he said Kent hates everybody equally. [/quote]
(dying laughing)
BerseliusQuote Reply
[quote name=Berselius]LaRussa has had issues with lots of players. Rolen comes to mind especially. Rasmus too IIRC.[/quote]Even Pujols. They’ve had their issues and it’s only going to get worse this year when the Cardinals find they’re not in contention. At that point nobody in the STL media will be paying any attention to the games and focusing on whether or not Pujols is leaving. Could get ugly.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I’m with AC. In the grand scheme, yeah, this isn’t a huge incident, but it’s another in a long train of incidents like this from this club, and it doesn’t bode well for the future.[/quote]What long train of incidents and how is it different than any other team? Nobody has provided any real evidence to suggest this isn’t common among all teams.
Further, so far with Quade we have one incident of a fight with players all on the team right? And it was Silva and Rammy, which was handled quietly.
I ask again, who gives a crap what happens and what is said once someone is gone? So long as while they’re on the team things are taken care of internally all should be quite well.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I didn’t see the Johnson/Sheen comments. Link?[/quote]
I don’t even remember what they were or who wrote them, just that it came up at some point early in ST.
BerseliusQuote Reply
Speaking of Jeff Kent, HOF or no?
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I don’t think Kent was the racist that some say. I think Berkman put it best when he said Kent hates everybody equally. I can’t imagine the kind of shit that happened between Kent and Bonds.[/quote]
I bet there was some sort of bullshit at least once a month if not more,but you never heard about it all until it happened in the dugout, and then you never heard anything more about it except the press trying to make something out of it because it involved Bonds.
Aisle424Quote Reply
Doug, I really don’t know if this same stuff happens with other teams. LaRussa and Guillen would be two examples so it probably does happen more often than we realize. Fair point.
We’re all in agreement stuff that happens between teammates should be none of our business.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Why is it necessary to be facetious? I never said Quade did something otherworldly. I simply said it’s good he stood strongly by his decision publicly. Good for Cashner and everybody else.[/quote]Why is it necessary to back down from your point when challenged? I’m sure Cashner was very happy to see the support, but I’m also sure he was happy to know Silva wasn’t mad at him and that a guy who has had success as a MLB SP sees great things in him. Quade didn’t do anything here that Silva didn’t do, in both the good and bad respects.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]I bet there was some sort of bullshit at least once a month if not more,but you never heard about it all until it happened in the dugout, and then you never heard anything more about it except the press trying to make something out of it because it involved Bonds.[/quote]
Out of curiosity, do we as Cub fans hear about any fights that take place in the locker room? If so, which ones?
DoogolasQuote Reply
Did Dusty ever say anything negative about Sosa? I’m having a hard time remembering, but I can’t remember anything off the top of my head.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Why is it necessary to back down from your point when challenged? I’m sure Cashner was very happy to see the support, but I’m also sure he was happy to know Silva wasn’t mad at him and that a guy who has had success as a MLB SP sees great things in him. Quade didn’t do anything here that Silva didn’t do, in both the good and bad respects.[/quote]
If I’m wrong, then shouldn’t I back down from a point? I mean, what do you want me to do, argue with you without any ability to adjust my point of view endlessly instead of trying to actually get somewhere?
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]What long train of incidents and how is it different than any other team? Nobody has provided any real evidence to suggest this isn’t common among all teams.
Further, so far with Quade we have one incident of a fight with players all on the team right? And it was Silva and Rammy, which was handled quietly.
I ask again, who gives a crap what happens and what is said once someone is gone? So long as while they’re on the team things are taken care of internally all should be quite well.[/quote]There’s evidence scattered across this thread.
Secondly, the Cubs shittalked Grace out of town, they shittalked Sosa out of town, they’ve tried on numerous occasions to shittalk Zambrano out of town.
I give a crap. I prefer the progfessional baseball team I support to behave like professionals. Sadly, i cannot say that of the Cubs.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Out of curiosity, do we as Cub fans hear about any fights that take place in the locker room? If so, which ones?[/quote]No, but I think what people are talking about is how much of an issue the team makes it when one is seen. The manager, coaches and GM go talk about it to the media (Hendry went on the radio after the fight last year to discuss it and I’d bet the same thing happened before). That seems bizarre to me.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]If I’m wrong, then shouldn’t I back down from a point? I mean, what do you want me to do, argue with you without any ability to adjust my point of view endlessly instead of trying to actually get somewhere?[/quote]
But you’re adjusting your point to avoid criticism, not to accommodate for it. But at this point, I’m thinking we’re likely just talking past one another.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]Doug, I really don’t know if this same stuff happens with other teams. LaRussa and Guillen would be two examples so it probably does happen more often than we realize. Fair point.
We’re all in agreement stuff that happens between teammates should be none of our business.[/quote]
Shit happens on all teams, I think it’s just that the Chicago media is much better at making mountains out of molehills than most other markets (probably only behind the Yankees/Red Sox axis).
BerseliusQuote Reply
Since this topic needs to be put to bed, new thread up: http://obstructedview.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=119:nl-central-questions-a-answers-houston-astros&catid=47:major-league-baseball&Itemid=229
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Out of curiosity, do we as Cub fans hear about any fights that take place in the locker room? If so, which ones?[/quote]Well, we all heard about Z punching Barrett in the locker room after punching him in the dugout, and everyone and their dog knows Kerry Wood smashed Sosa’s boom box with a ball bat.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]What long train of incidents and how is it different than any other team?[/quote]
Sosa and the Cubs making a point of telling everybody he left early after the last game of the season, and then showing security videos to prove it. Completely unnecessary and unprofessional.
They wanted to send Carlos Zambrano to his room without dinner last year after his incident with Lee.
They wouldn’t ever shut up about Milton Bradley when if they had left it alone, it would have been clear to anyone with a brain that Bradley isn’t quite living in our world of reality.
They even have started in with Castro by singling him out as needing to focus on his defense when everybody on the damn team was flubbing plays left and right.
Even when the Cubs’ actions are justified and somewhat understandable given the circumstances, they always seem to choose the path that involves them being self-righteous and petty.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]There’s evidence scattered across this thread.
Secondly, the Cubs shittalked Grace out of town, they shittalked Sosa out of town, they’ve tried on numerous occasions to shittalk Zambrano out of town.
I give a crap. I prefer the progfessional baseball team I support to behave like professionals. Sadly, i cannot say that of the Cubs.[/quote]
I’m not drinking any Kool-Aid. But you still have provided no evidence that this doesn’t happen with other teams, I’m almost certain that it has and does.
I don’t look at the Grace shit talk any differently than the Kent-Bonds stuff that took place.
The Yankees have talked tons of shit about various players, Giambi and A-Rod off the top of my head.
I don’t follow other organizations super, super closely though, so I have no idea all the incidents that occur. I am simply fairly certain this is not something that is only found in the Cubs organization.
DoogolasQuote Reply
I like a little fire. Lets all face it. The Cubs need it… no not you Big Z!
Quade seems unafraid to speak his mind and be himself. Its baseball, not Mideast peace negotiations.
If and when the Cubs make the postseason we need a coach like Quade especially for those home games when everyone is wound tighter than a ducks ass.
Also as a Cubs fan I’ve always liked Ozzie.
JadeQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]I’m not drinking any Kool-Aid. But you still have provided no evidence that this doesn’t happen with other teams, I’m almost certain that it has and does.
I don’t look at the Grace shit talk any differently than the Kent-Bonds stuff that took place.
The Yankees have talked tons of shit about various players, Giambi and A-Rod off the top of my head.
I don’t follow other organizations super, super closely though, so I have no idea all the incidents that occur. I am simply fairly certain this is not something that is only found in the Cubs organization.[/quote]I provided 3 incidents. That’s evidence. Aisle 424 just gave a couple more. Ignore it all you want, but it’s right fucking here.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Jade]I like a little fire. Lets all face it. The Cubs need it… no not you Big Z!
Quade seems unafraid to speak his mind and be himself. Its baseball, not Mideast peace negotiations.
If and when the Cubs make the postseason we need a coach like Quade especially for those home games when everyone is wound tighter than a ducks ass.
Also as a Cubs fan I’ve always liked Ozzie.[/quote]So when Quade yells and curses, it’s awesome, when Z does it, it’s bad. Got it. You sound like a true Cub fan.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]Well, we all heard about Z punching Barrett in the locker room after punching him in the dugout, and everyone and their dog knows Kerry Wood smashed Sosa’s boom box with a ball bat.[/quote]
I can’t remember who it was, but I heard on the radio one of the guys with access (maybe Levine?) said it wasn’t who you would think it would be. I think we all thought it was Wood when it happened, so I’ve assumed it wasn’t him.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]I can’t remember who it was, but I heard on the radio one of the guys with access (maybe Levine?) said it wasn’t who you would think it would be. I think we all thought it was Wood when it happened, so I’ve assumed it wasn’t him.[/quote]I’ve always heard Wood, but perhaps that’s just become apocryphal. (dying laughing) Still, we heard about that incident.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]Sosa and the Cubs making a point of telling everybody he left early after the last game of the season, and then showing security videos to prove it. Completely unnecessary and unprofessional.
They wanted to send Carlos Zambrano to his room without dinner last year after his incident with Lee.
They wouldn’t ever shut up about Milton Bradley when if they had left it alone, it would have been clear to anyone with a brain that Bradley isn’t quite living in our world of reality.
They even have started in with Castro by singling him out as needing to focus on his defense when everybody on the damn team was flubbing plays left and right.
Even when the Cubs’ actions are justified and somewhat understandable given the circumstances, they always seem to choose the path that involves them being self-righteous and petty.[/quote]
The Sosa thing was completely ridiculous. I’m still pissed about that. Never has been nor will be justifiable.
The Bradley thing, eh, whatever. He made a bigger ass out of himself than anybody else. And most of the other stuff was on Lou.
Quade singling out Castro on his defense I have no problem with. Managers of other team’s call out their players on doing X badly all the time, in all sports. It’s not like he said Castro was being an asshole. Simply that he wasn’t focusing. That’s a pretty common thing for managers/coaches to do.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]I provided 3 incidents. That’s evidence. Aisle 424 just gave a couple more. Ignore it all you want, but it’s right fucking here.[/quote]You’ve provided evidence that it happens here. Not that it doesn’t happen elsewhere.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]You’ve provided evidence that it happens here. Not that it doesn’t happen elsewhere.[/quote]We’ve cited incidents at SF, TB, and MIL where it was handled much, much better.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]I can’t remember who it was, but I heard on the radio one of the guys with access (maybe Levine?) said it wasn’t who you would think it would be. I think we all thought it was Wood when it happened, so I’ve assumed it wasn’t him.[/quote]
Mike Remlinger. At least if you heard it on the radio last year like I did.
DoogolasQuote Reply
I’ll agree that no team is perfect, and most teams go through periods where the front office takes on a certain personality of those in charge at the time, but the Cubs seem to invite it.
Hell, they’ve been driving talented players out of town since Bill Madlock was too uppity for the Wrigleys.
Aisle424Quote Reply
So sometimes it is okay to talk about players that are still on the team?
I
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Mike Remlinger. At least if you heard it on the radio last year like I did.[/quote]
That may have been the greatest thing Remlinger did as a Cub.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]We’ve cited incidents at SF, TB, and MIL where it was handled much, much better.[/quote]In what way was SF handling it better?
TB and MIL handled it no different than the early ST incident. An example proves nothing at all. There have almost 100% for certain been countless fights on various teams that handled shit awfully.
http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/recap?gameId=220625125
You’re telling me that was handled well, seriously?
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Mike Remlinger. At least if you heard it on the radio last year like I did.[/quote]I thought Remlinger denied it pretty quick, although Wood has denied it, too. I’m wondering if everyone didn’t run by and give it a whack, Office Space style (dying laughing)
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
At least we agree on this.
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]So sometimes it is okay to talk about players that are still on the team?
I[/quote]Saying somebody needs to focus is not shit talking. It’s just saying somebody needs to do focus. I have a problem with someone saying player X is an asshole or something of that nature.
I have no problem with somebody saying that somebody needs to focus on attribute X.
Those are two VERY different things. Let’s not twist words.
DoogolasQuote Reply
You asked for examples, I provided them, you now say this. I think we’re done here, yes?
Mercurial OutfielderQuote Reply
[quote name=Mercurial Outfielder]You asked for examples, I provided them, you now say this. I think we’re done here, yes?[/quote]The Bonds thing is a terrible example. That was handled God-awfully.
Also, in 05, here is something Baker had to say about Bonds:
I said there is no evidence this doesn’t happen other places. Nobody has shown that that’s not the case. Because there are examples of the Cubs handling shit internally as well. That doesn’t mean that things like today don’t happen.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]
Quade singling out Castro on his defense I have no problem with. Managers of other team’s call out their players on doing X badly all the time, in all sports. It’s not like he said Castro was being an asshole. Simply that he wasn’t focusing. That’s a pretty common thing for managers/coaches to do.[/quote]
Because it happens all the time doesn’t make it right. If I’m Castro and I’m watching Blake DeWitt fuck up every play hit to him and then the coach calls me in to talk about my defense, I might be a little perturbed about it. but then if the manager goes and announces to the media that he had to sit down with me to talk about my defense specifically? Fuck that. That is bullshit and childish.
You can motivate people without embarassing them in the papers and giving fodder to the people who are just looking for reasons to jump on the kid because he’s not Albert Pujols yet and because he hangs out with that other lazy, selfish jerk, Soriano.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]In what way was SF handling it better?
TB and MIL handled it no different than the early ST incident. An example proves nothing at all. There have almost 100% for certain been countless fights on various teams that handled shit awfully.
http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/recap?gameId=220625125
You’re telling me that was handled well, seriously?[/quote]funny what you remember and then read an article to realize how wrong that belief was. I don’t remember that much being made of the Bonds/Kent issue, but clearly it was out of hand at that point.
mb21Quote Reply
Remlinger makes sense. That ESPN guy who wrote a book about the 2004 Cubs said it was a veteran free-agent.
Suburban kidQuote Reply
As for singling out Castro, that’s another example of something that could have been handled much better. The guy was 20 years old. Whatever is said to the media has to be carefully framed because he’s so young. He’s so far away from being at his peak that you just can’t expect perfection. If the Cubs had a decent SS in 2010 he doesn’t even make his big league debut until this season. He was pushed into MLB action and fared better than anyone could have expected. He has stuff to improve on. Who doesn’t? I’m pretty sure Castro knew his defense needed improved. You could see in his eyes how upset he was after he made an error. One time I thought he was going to cry.
mb21Quote Reply
Exactly! If you’re going to motivate people by making them fear they’ll lose their job, all you’ve motivated them to do is just enough to keep their job.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424]Because it happens all the time doesn’t make it right. If I’m Castro and I’m watching Blake DeWitt fuck up every play hit to him and then the coach calls me in to talk about my defense, I might be a little perturbed about it. but then if the manager goes and announces to the media that he had to sit down with me to talk about my defense specifically? Fuck that. That is bullshit and childish.
You can motivate people without embarassing them in the papers and giving fodder to the people who are just looking for reasons to jump on the kid because he’s not Albert Pujols yet and because he hangs out with that other lazy, selfish jerk, Soriano.[/quote]First off, I love Soriano. And the way the media portray him pisses me off. Super nice guy. I’ve had a good 30 second chat with him before, even if I couldn’t understand half of what he was saying, he seemed to be super nice.
As to the actual thing said, Castro is a super young guy.
http://archive.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/09/cubs-quade-sits-castro-after-mental-gaffe.html
Read what Quade actually said. He really didn’t say anything particularly harsh to the media. “He should sit and watch a game or two. It was a mental gaffe, no screaming or yelling, just needs to take a couple games off and learn from it.”
It’s really no big deal. He didn’t say Castro was a lazy piece of shit or anything. Simply that he was getting a day off from a stupid mistake that shouldn’t happen. He’s young, it happens, he’ll sit a day, learn from it, move on.
Is it a little embarrassing? Probably. But it happens in all sports.
Maybe you’re right, it might not be right. But it’s something that every manager and coach has done before. So I guess I’m far more desensitized to the silliness of the idea and thus it doesn’t bother me.
DoogolasQuote Reply
Hell, rereading it most of what they said was “He’s had a lot thrown at him. A break will be good for him.”
They focused way more on his insane workload than they did on the actual gaffe itself.
DoogolasQuote Reply
How are you treated at your job when you make a mistake? We all make them and most people would rather be confronted one on one by their boss. In fact, many people actually encourage people to tell them when they’ve made a mistake. What they don’t like is when that mistake has been made public. It’s demeaning.
There’s absolutely nothing wrong with giving Castro a day off after making a terrible decision. I encourage it, but do you have to tell the world you’re giving him a timeout? Just give him the day off and say it’s nothing more than a day off. Everybody will know what it is, but at least you’re not making Castro feel worse.
Sometimes I think it helps to think of these things in terms of our own lives. If I fired someone at work, I am absolutely not going to go around the office telling people what an asshole or incompetent person that guy was. I would never do that. Never. I would tell the other employees to get back to work and I’d go to my office.
I would not defend myself from the fired employee if he made nasty remarks about me. I would be surprised if the person fired thought kindly of me in that moment. Firing the employee said everything and more words from me on that is just crazy.
This isn’t to say that most bosses would act in that way. I don’t know, but what I know is that any boss who prides his or herself on professionalism would not go around the office talking shit about the fired player or respond to some mildly negative remarks about his or herself.
i think people’s reaction is to defend themselves always. I can’t fault Silva, Hendry or Quade because I think it’s a natural reaction, but it doesn’t mean there wasn’t a better way to handle it.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]Hell, rereading it most of what they said was “He’s had a lot thrown at him. A break will be good for him.”
They focused way more on his insane workload than they did on the actual gaffe itself.[/quote]True, but acknowledging his mistake and a day off was singling him out for a mistake despite his insane workload. You can handle things out of the media. I’m not saying all teams do it that way. I’d guess they don’t considering the juvenile nature of most the players, coaches, managers, and general managers.
All I’m saying is there is a more professional way to handle it.
mb21Quote Reply
I can agree with that mb. There are certainly better ways of handling things. But like you said, most organizations, from the GM to the players are filled with pretty immature people. So it comes with the territory.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424 giving fodder to the people who are just looking for reasons to jump on the kid because he’s not Albert Pujols yet and because he hangs out with that other lazy, selfish jerk, Soriano.[/quote]
Don’t worry. The Bleacher denizens don’t hate Castro yet and lump him in with the other lazy minorities on the team. After all, he hasn’t gotten a big contract yet. He’s still a young kid so he gets slack. When he gets his big deal though…. watch out.
Hector VillanuevaQuote Reply
As long as he’s hitting .320 nobody will get on him I’m sure.
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=Doug]I can agree with that mb. There are certainly better ways of handling things. But like you said, most organizations, from the GM to the players are filled with pretty immature people. So it comes with the territory.[/quote]It seems we’re pretty much in agreement. My complaint is only that there are better ways to deal with this stuff than the Cubs generally do. It may be a league wide issue for all I know.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=mb21]It seems we’re pretty much in agreement. My complaint is only that there are better ways to deal with this stuff than the Cubs generally do. It may be a league wide issue for all I know.[/quote]
The last thing you said is my only question. I feel like every team handles this stuff pretty much equally terribly. Look at the Red Sox with Nomar and Manny for example. That was probably even worse than some of the ways we’ve handled things.
*shrug* The Cubs should try to do a better job handling things maturely though.
DoogolasQuote Reply
I’ll admit it’s important to consider how other teams handle the same situations, but it’s not the Red Sox who are pissing me off for trashing players like Sosa. I’ve never seen anything like that at all. Release a video the public to prove he left early? What the hell? That was ridiculous. I also thought the way they handled the Bradley issue was ridiculous. Bradley was insane. The Cubs would have been wise in the end to just let Bradley do all the talking.
mb21Quote Reply
[quote name=Doug]As long as he’s hitting .320 nobody will get on him I’m sure.[/quote]
(dying laughing)
Good luck with that, Starlin.
Aisle424Quote Reply
[quote name=Aisle424](dying laughing)
Good luck with that, Starlin.[/quote]Yee of little faith! It’s totally gonna happen. Kid’s gonna be Derek Jeter with defense. Don’t ruin my dreams.
@MB21:
Oh yeah, like I said earlier, there is no defense for what the Cubs did to Sosa. I’d like to personally line up everybody behind all that crap and nut punch them once. For all he did for the organization to not even let him leave with some dignity is beyond ridiculous. I will always and forever be pissed as hell about that.
The Red Sox did a lot to Manny and Nomar though. Not to the extent that the Cubs went with Sosa, but they certainly did make those two out to be awful, awful people.
As for Bradley, they probably should have shut up. But what’s done is done. As long as this is the end of it I guess I just don’t really care about the response.
It’s early on in the year so I’m at my peak of optimism and defense of things that the Cubs do. Give it a few months and if things aren’t going well I’ll be very quick to jump down Quade’s throat. But for now I’d like to give him the benefit of the doubt and be hopeful that maybe he knows what he’s doing and won’t have any royal media f-ups like every other manager before him.
So far he’s done that for me. As I don’t consider this anything particularly odd and since Silva is gone I on’t even care that he badmouthed him, so long as this is the end of it.
Also, back to Castro, he’s gonna hit .350, because for once a prospect isn’t going to let me down horrifically for falling in love with him. 🙁
DoogolasQuote Reply
[quote name=mb21]I’ll admit it’s important to consider how other teams handle the same situations, but it’s not the Red Sox who are pissing me off for trashing players like Sosa. I’ve never seen anything like that at all. Release a video the public to prove he left early? What the hell? That was ridiculous. I also thought the way they handled the Bradley issue was ridiculous. Bradley was insane. The Cubs would have been wise in the end to just let Bradley do all the talking.[/quote]
I don’t know. If memory serves the Nomar situation wasn’t handled very well. The Manny situation was more than a little crazy at times too.
Corporate PuddingQuote Reply
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ClaudetteQuote Reply