As much grumbling as there has been at the Cubs slow start, this series offers a stark reminder that it could be much worse. The Giants season can be summed up with the fact that Giants ace Madison Bumgarner, who has been out since late April due to a dirtbike accident, has the team's third highest offensive WAR on the season. Aside from Posey and Belt, just about everyone else has been awful, and the team as a whole has a .232/.289/.349, the worst offense in baseball. Their starting staff has been pretty good despite losing one of the top ten pitchers in MLB, at least by FIP (3rd), but they are middle in the pack in ERA despite having a decent defense behind them.
Team Leaders
Giants
- OBP: Buster Posey (.441)
- ISO: Brandon Belt (.222)
- HR: Belt (8)
- R+RBI: Belt (41)
- wRC+: Posey (170)
- BSR: Eduardo Nunez (1.5)
- SP K/9: Jeff Samardzija (10.48)
- SP BB/9: Samardzija (?!) (1.48)
- SP FIP: Samardzija (2.90)
- RP K/9: Hunter Strickland (9.92)
- RP BB/9: Mark Melancon (0.71)
- RP FIP: Bryan Morris (2.12)
- WAR: Posey (1.8)
Great year for Shark, peripherals-wise. However he has a 4.57 ERA and a 1-5 record thanks to sequencing and this terrible offense (dying laughing).
Cubs
- OBP: Kris Bryant (.411)
- ISO: Bryant (.285)
- HR: Bryant (10)
- R+RBI: Bryant (52)
- wRC+: Bryant (159)
- BSR: Jon Jay (2.5)
- SP K/9: Jake Arrieta (9.87)
- SP BB/9: John Lackey (2.47)
- SP FIP: Jon Lester (3.48)
- RP K/9: Carl Edwards Jr (12.46)
- RP BB/9: Brian Duensing (1.42)
- RP FIP: Wade Davis (1.37)
- WAR: Bryant (1.4)
Injuries, transactions, vengeance pacts, etc.
Jason Heyward is back up, which sent Tommy La Stella back to Iowa. Joining him was Pierce Johnson, who was replaced by the recently shelled Dylan Floro.
The Giants have a bunch of guys on the injury report, not surprisingly. As mentioned above the biggest abscense is Bumgarner, but they are also missing outfielder/homeless person Hunter Pence to a hamstring injury. He's eligble to come back in this series, but it's not looking likely as he hasn't tried to run on it yet. Aaron Hill is on a rehab assignment for a forearm strain and may be back soon, and closer Mark Melancon was activated off the DL last week a little earlier than the team planned.
Pitching Probables
K%, BB%, ERA, projected ERA listed for each starter.
Monday: Ty Blach, LHP (7.6%, 6.9%, 4.15, 4.43) vs John Lackey, RHP (23.7%, 6.3%, 4.37, 3.74), 7:05 PM CT
Blach has a comically low strikeout rate. It's a early season fluke, but not *that* much of one as he is projected to have a strikeout rate of around five batters per nine. He's a sinker-changeup guy, who tops out around 90, but unless he's the second coming of Brandon Webb* there's little chance he can succeed with those strikeout rates. /dooms Cubs to a complete game, 0 K shutout
*holy cow, Webb's career was WAY shorter than I would have guessed. He only pitched for six seasons.
(Lackey comment repeated due to laziness) I was surprised to find that Lackey has actually thrown the most innings of all of the Cubs starters. He's neck and neck with Lester for the best xFIP among the Cubs starters, he's just given up some extra homers.
Tuesday: Johnny Cueto, RHP (21.2%, 6.5%, 4.50, 3.24) vs Jon Lester, LHP (23.9%, 9.3%, 3.57, 3.20), 7:05 PM CT
Cueto's walk rate has jumped a bit and he's had a few more fly balls leave the yard, but the biggest change from last season is a large dip in his ground ball rate. Perhaps his biggest contribution has been his ability to work deep into games early in the season, which is something we certainly haven't seen much of lately.
Lester seems to have mostly figured out the whole stolen base thing this year. Rather than trying to get him to throw to first, the team seems to have keyed into taking advantage of just how uncomfortable runners are against him, getting pickoffs on stuff like lobs to second on botched steals as well as going after backpicks at first from Willson even more aggresively than last year. By my eyeball norm it almost feels like a net positive.
Wednesday: Matt Moore, RHP (19.2%, 8.9%, 5.37, 4.08) vs Kyle Hendricks, RHP (20.2%, 9.6%, 3.35, 3.45), 7:05 PM CT
I was out in the Bay Area for work at the beginning of the season, sporting my World Series Champions hat, and all the Giants fans out there were still groaning about Moore being pulled after the 8th inning in game four of the NLDS. He absolutely owned this Cubs in that game, striking out ten and allowing just two hits and a walk in eight innings. The Cubs came back to score four runs and take the lead against seemingly the entire Giants bullpen in the ninth, and the rest was history.
The Kyle Hendricks Concern-O-Meter is down to about a two right now. He looks like his old self, though I don't really expect him to contend for a Cy Young again.
Thursday: Jeff Samardzija, RHP (28.5%, 4.0%, 4.57, 3.49) vs Eddie Butler, RHP (20.0%, 20.0%, 2.00, 5.02), 1:20 PM CT
Shark has been great, but has a .331 BABIP and a 63.3% strand rate. He has been giving up a ton of line drives, which I guess could explain a lot of that, but still. Also, I miss xBABIP. Was that discredited? I haven't seen it around in a while. Maybe it was at THT?
Butler was, uh, not good on Friday. The weather was pretty awful but he couldn't find the plate at all. He looked pretty good in his first start so there's still some hope there, and I still think he's better than Brett Anderson. But yeesh.
Comments
If the Cubs don’t score 30 tonight, it should be considered a loss.
dmick89Quote Reply
So Schwarber has been worth -0.1 fWAR to this point. I figured he might hit a sophomore slump, but that’s pretty ugly at the top of a lineup.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Perkins,
Yeah, it’s not been fun watching him this season. I’m surprised it took Joe this long to move him down in the lineup and I’m still surprised he hasn’t moved him further down the lineup. I guess the team just doesn’t really have anyone who should be hitting leadoff. They really only have Bryant and Rizzo and Rizzo hasn’t been all that good so far.
dmick89Quote Reply
I wonder if Shark will be an acquisition target. I don’t think he embodies Cubs’ culture, but I also don’t think he can’t fit—he certainly works hard. Thoyer offered something like a 5/75 extension a few years back. They might be able to get 3.5/60 rather easily.
The Giants need all sorts of offensive help, so they might be willing to swing a deal. They also need all sorts of pitching help, so they might not (dying laughing).
ceruleanQuote Reply
*This is assuming getting Archer will take Baez, Happ, and Jimenez for starters.
ceruleanQuote Reply
I am intrigued by Brian Hudson—not because his BB-rate and K-rate are equal (and equally poor), but because of his groundball-rate. He is a lanky lefty with a lot of moving parts, but he could be something quite effective in a few years.
ceruleanQuote Reply
It’s hard to believe that the Cubs once had Archer and more for the low price of Mark DeRosa, and could still have had him but for that buttfuckingly stupid Matt Garza trade. Then again, maybe he wouldn’t have developed as well in the Cubs’ farm system.
PerkinsQuote Reply
I want to go on the record in saying that I really don’t see Baez being traded. In fact, Schwarber is probably more likely to be traded just because of positional flexibility. And I say this thinking that Schwarber can be adequate in left and behind the plate.
Baez looks like the only good defender at SS that can hit worth a damn after Russell in the entire org. There are a lot of almost* SS on the team—Bryant, La Stella, Zobrist, Happ—but if Russell goes down, the Cubs would have to swing a deal.
Speaking of deal-swinging, I wish the Cubs had swung a deal for Wade Davis instead of Chapman*—though injury certainly played a factor.
*This asterisk is too small.
*Yeah, yeah, 2016 World Champions. The Cubs got still got fleeced on the deal.
ceruleanQuote Reply
What is Cubs Culture?
EdwinQuote Reply
cerulean,
I think Cueto is the more likely target, but I’m guessing the Cubs don’t do much if anything. I don’t see the talent available that would allow them to swing a major deal. Maybe they acquire a reliever for Candelario or something, but that’s about it.
dmick89Quote Reply
To-day’s Happless base ball squadron
LF Zobrist
CF Almora
3B Bryant
1B Rizzo
C Contreras
SS Russell
RF Heyward
2B Baez
P Lackey
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
cerulean,
Davis would have been more expensive at the trade deadline, though, and I’m quite happy with the deal they got in the off-season. Honestly, I’m surprised they were able to trade Soler for a useful player at this point.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Rizzo the Rat,
Wasn’t Davis hurt at that point of the season?
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Who will the Cubs try to sneak through waivers to add Rosscup?
Rice in limboQuote Reply
Rice in limbo,
Why not Butler and put Monty in the rotation? That’s probably how the season should have started. I don’t expect much from him, but he’s better than Butler and Anderson.
dmick89Quote Reply
Rice in limbo,
Anderson, hopefully, though I feel like that’s more like ‘who will the Cubs try to loudly announce is on waivers in the hopes that some other team notices’ than a ‘sneak.’
uncle daveQuote Reply
uncle dave,
I’m guessing they try to do that at some point when he’s healthy (toward the end of his rehab assignment whenever that is).
dmick89Quote Reply
dmick89,
I think he has about five more starts before the incentives start to kick in. Will be interesting to see if they give him one more shot to get it right.
uncle daveQuote Reply
uncle dave,
Buchanan was DFA. I think they can probably sneak him through waivers. That buys them time to see whether they need to DFA Duensing or Anderson, but I don’t think they will.
Rice in limboQuote Reply
Crap.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Cubs lose.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Russell!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Almora!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
There’s that defense.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Give credit to Lackey for those defensive plays. He made sure his teammates weren’t out of their element.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
I could watch Zo foul off pitches all day.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I’ve gotten used to turning on the game right after it starts to find out the Cubs are already behind.
dmick89Quote Reply
Meat grinder dot gif
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
So I’m thinking Zobrist would be a better guy to lead off than Schwarber. At least for now.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Rizzo has been hitting way too many weak grounders this year.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
This Panik guy is pretty annoying.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Cy Blach. 😐
ceruleanQuote Reply
Just before the deadline yes. And so was Soler. Win-win.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Lackey isn’t doing a good job of holding runners.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I was worried the Cubs scored all their runs for the week yesterday. Maybe Lackey is going to allow all the runs the Cubs will allow this week.
dmick89Quote Reply
dmick89Quote Reply
Or preventing them from reaching base. Or scoring.
ceruleanQuote Reply
DEFENSE!
ceruleanQuote Reply
I don’t know that I have ever seen a 2–5–4 DP. Contreras–Bryant–Baez. Tinker–Evers–Chance.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Batters hit John Lackey. John Lackey hits them back. (dying laughing)
ceruleanQuote Reply
Seriously, knock it off.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Rizzo channeling 2006 Derrek Lee. Psst—2005 was the good one, Anthony.
ceruleanQuote Reply
cerulean,
Matt Murton was the weakass ground ball king.
dmick89Quote Reply
Fuck, John.
ceruleanQuote Reply
I think it’s safe to assume the Cubs aren’t coming back tonight.
They look tired.
PerkinsQuote Reply
And the Giants offense is one of the worst.
ceruleanQuote Reply
This team is warmed-over ass right now.
uncle daveQuote Reply
At least Lackey is out of the game.
ceruleanQuote Reply
What the hell, Almora?
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Bryant got screwed.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Hey, offense.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
ZEN BROFIST
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Ugh.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I think we all saw that GIDP coming.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Screw the opposing closer
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
I mean, you can’t expect to beat a guy who’s only on the roster because Madison Bumgarner hurt himself in a freak dirt bike accident.
PerkinsQuote Reply
He got three strikeouts, and two of those were BS called third strikes.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I’m also getting tired of all these home run derbies.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
The Cubs are kind of lucky to even be sitting above .500, even if it is only one game above. This team could easily be a couple games worse than the Pirates.
dmick89Quote Reply
I can see it either way.
ceruleanQuote Reply
That’s his guru/wrestling/porn name, right?
ceruleanQuote Reply
cerulean,
I could see them being better than the Brewers based on the Brewers luck, but not the Cubs. The Cubs have been lucky to steal several games late that no team can expect to win. This team has played no better than .500 baseball so far. They look like crap to me.
dmick89Quote Reply
I didn’t realize Zambrano threw out the first pitch last night? That’s cool to see.
EdwinQuote Reply
To day’s base ball squadron:
Zobrist
Schwarber
Bryant
Rizzo
Happ
Heyward
Contreras
Russell
Lester
PerkinsQuote Reply
Edwin,
He apparently was able to hit 90-91 on the gun depending on who you believe.
Rice in limboQuote Reply
Rice in limbo,
I only believe things I read on Twitter.
EdwinQuote Reply
Rice in limbo,
That’s about what he was hitting in the later part of his career. I’m guessing even if he’s been playing a lot and was warmed up that he’d have trouble hitting 87 or 88 these days. Wouldn’t surprise me if 85 was pushing it.
dmick89Quote Reply
Edwin,
I only believe tweets with the hashtag #MAGA. The rest of them are fake tweets.
dmick89Quote Reply
dmick89,
That’s the point. They have looked terrible. And they have won half their games. And according to run differential, they have been about a game unlucky. #MAGA so you know it’s real.
ceruleanQuote Reply
The start of tonight’s loss has been delayed.
dmick89Quote Reply
cerulean,
That looks like it’s too many characters to be a tweet. Fake.
dmick89Quote Reply
Would be even cooler to see Sammy Sosa throw one out.
dmick89Quote Reply
Another delay.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Now they’re starting.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Lester!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Schwarber!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
HEYWARD
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Lester is dealing tonight
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
RIZZO!!!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Phew.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
My mind is still grappling with the idea of a Cubs player homering with a runner on base.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
What an outing by Lester.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I know Lester is going great, but they have to pinch-hit here.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Filthy.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Inverted M
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Great game by Lester.
dmick89Quote Reply
Yeah, I enjoy a complete game even if it’s technically “wrong.”
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
That was a game I recently enjoyed in person. Hell of an outing by Lester, and Schwarber’s HR was manly.
PerkinsQuote Reply
But for that blip in the fifth, Lester would have had a Maddux.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Perkins,
Does it have to be a shutout to be a Maddux, or merely a complete game?
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Berselius is too lazy to login,
Has to be a shutout.
PerkinsQuote Reply
http://groundballwitheyes.blogspot.com/2012/04/maddux.html
EdwinQuote Reply
Also have to define #weirdbaseball and batting around.
Rice in limboQuote Reply
Let’s call it a maculately-conceived Maddux.
ceruleanQuote Reply
So, anybody excited about Johnson-Hanks 2020? I hope they pick Meryl Streep as Secretary of State. (She could totally infiltrate the Russians.) #MAGAFRTT
ceruleanQuote Reply
cerulean,
Sure, if they turn the debates into a wrestling match, I’m all for it. I’d love to watch Trump get his ass beat for awhile. Somehow though, after thoroughly getting his ass kicked, he’d claim that he won the debate.
dmick89Quote Reply
cerulean,
Johnson?
uncle daveQuote Reply
uncle dave,
The Rock.
dmick89Quote Reply
don’t be fatuous Jeffrey
EdwinQuote Reply
To day’s base ball squadron:
Baez
Almora
Bryant
Rizzo
Happ (LF)
Heyward
Russell
Montero
Hendricks
It’s a bold strategy, Cotton. Let’s see if it pays off.
PerkinsQuote Reply
dmick89,
Ah, yes. Thought Oprah was gonna be on that ticket, tho.
uncle daveQuote Reply
Oh no.
uncle daveQuote Reply
Montero starting against a LHP? Does he have a personal catcher thing going on with Kyle?
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Maybe Willson just needed a break
BerseliusQuote Reply
Berselius,
Then give him a break against a righty. There are lots of those.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Oh yes.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Wind blowing in and cold for Hendricks. I like those odds.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Russell makes another stupid throw.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Why was Russell even throwing to first? He does that a lot when he has no shot.
dmick89Quote Reply
21 pitches to get through four batters 😐
ceruleanQuote Reply
I didn’t pay attention to the lineup. I thought I missed an inning or two with Baez and Almora up. Fascinating. I guess today is all about the defense.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Ugh. That started out so promisingly.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Perkins,
That’s Bryant’s eleventh GIDP…
…in his career.
ceruleanQuote Reply
This sucks.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
cerulean,
That’s pretty impressive, though not terribly surprising given his fly ball tendencies.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Rizzo!!!!!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Tony!
PerkinsQuote Reply
RIZZO!
ceruleanQuote Reply
Rizzo would be having a great year of he hadn’t offended the BABIP gods somehow.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
So forget what I said.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Gah.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Rizzo again!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Tony again!!!!!
PerkinsQuote Reply
uncle daveQuote Reply
BABIP gods have nothing on Rizzo. (dying laughing)
ceruleanQuote Reply
That Hendricks at-bat was pathetic. Bunting with no outs on an 0-2 count?
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Why didn’t Joe pinch hit for Hendricks? It’s not at all like Joe not to pull a starter when a scoring opportunity presents itself.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Solid Javy AB.
ceruleanQuote Reply
cerulean,
I was surprised he got anything he could get a bat on down 0-2.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I would have thrown him a breaking ball a foot outside.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
The hell was that?
PerkinsQuote Reply
Perkins,
They’re calling that a “single.”
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
dmick89Quote Reply
Rizzo’s got dirt on the BABIP gods.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Thought it was going to stay fair.
dmick89Quote Reply
I wish Bryant had gone to third.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Rizzo the Rat,
Rizzo heard you.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Jesus.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
That’s a fucking horseshit call.
PerkinsQuote Reply
The fuck is that
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
WTF!
ceruleanQuote Reply
Bullshit.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Sounds like a bad rule rather than a bad call. Still, ugh.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Fuck you umps.
ceruleanQuote Reply
When it’s a bad rule, then you make a non-call. Enforcing a bad rule makes a bad call.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Nice save by Rizzo.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Russell needs to learn how to throw and how to hold onto a bat.
dmick89Quote Reply
Miggy!
PerkinsQuote Reply
Solid start by Cyle. Nice to see Cubs starters pitching past the fifth for once.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Not bad, Kyle.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Hendricks looked shaky to start, but a solid outing.
PerkinsQuote Reply
cerulean,
It’s not the officiator’s job to decide which rules to enforce.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Baez!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Sometimes good things happen on terrible bunts.
dmick89Quote Reply
Screw the closer!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Break this wide open.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Don’t love that bunt with two catchers on the base paths but I’ll take the gift run.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Wasn’t Montero out of the baseline? Isn’t that an automatic triple play?
ceruleanQuote Reply
Good job by Willy there
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
That was frustrating.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Damn. Here’s hoping their failure to screw the closer doesn’t bite them in the ass.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Wait, they let Montero run the bases and then they took him out anyway?
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Rizzo the Rat,
Yep
dmick89Quote Reply
Enter Enderman.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Outs, please.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Throw strikes, please.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
God damn it.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
STRIKES.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Some strikes would be okay
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Berselius is too lazy to login,
Too easy.
dmick89Quote Reply
This is why you screw the closer.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Edwards threw something in the zone!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Whew!
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
I wouldn’t advise that strategy be used often.
dmick89Quote Reply
Whew
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Exit Enderman.
ceruleanQuote Reply
J-Hey!!!
PerkinsQuote Reply
Heyward! Now he has twice as many triples as doubles.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
J-HEY!
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
After being robbed a few times, great to see Jason make hay.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Jay? Maddon must be really committed to resting Zobrist and Schwarber.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Damn.
ceruleanQuote Reply
(dying laughing), Pat made it sound like that was going to land on Sheffield.
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
That at-bat sucked.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
????????????
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
That was dildos.
PerkinsQuote Reply
😐 😐 😐
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Nothing is easy.
dmick89Quote Reply
Stupid bullpen.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Jesus
dmick89Quote Reply
DP please.Another out please.
ceruleanQuote Reply
The Cubs should have seven or eight runs at least. Should have been no reason to need Davis tonight.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Cubs lose.
dmick89Quote Reply
Javy!
PerkinsQuote Reply
Stop falling behind hitters, please.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Damn it.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
Montgomery and Strop are up in the bullpen.
Well, we’re boned.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Frustrating victory.
Rizzo the RatQuote Reply
False.
PerkinsQuote Reply
Rotated E
Berselius is too lazy to loginQuote Reply
Umpire wanted to go home. Thanks.
dmick89Quote Reply
Awww, Panik didn’t like the call. About time the Cubs got a break.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Davis had the ”eye of the tiger” and was ”In the zone”.
Addy is not one to shy away from cliché.
ceruleanQuote Reply
Perkins,
I don’t think Davis had seen game action in something like a week, so maybe every now and then he should mop up just to keep the gears greased.
Rice CubeQuote Reply
Rice Cube,
Yeah, that probably wouldn’t hurt, but I think all those fouls really got to him. He seemed irritated, which is natural. I wouldn’t expect that to happen again even with long rest.
dmick89Quote Reply
http://obstructedview.net/cubs-5-giants-4-5-24-17/
berseliusQuote Reply